charles roberts

[Toppy Vann]

I don't think Smith/Roberts was a bad trade. It was getting something for a guy they would have ended up releasing (big contract, no passion). Remember, BC was 4 and 5 pre-trade, and 7 and 2 after.

As for MB's original question, despite the injury, it's a reasonable idea. The reason it won't happen I believe is that BC is going to be pretty deep with quality RBs this year (A. Allen, Smart, Lee? Logan? plus a few other new signings). Perhaps not from the get-go at training camp, but I'll bet at least one big name currently trying the NFL is expected to join the team.

I thought it was horrible....especially considering the fact that Wally said there was no room for both Joe Smith and Logan in the lineup but tried to change things so he could play both Roberts and Logan.

As for Roberts being a good back out of the backfield...Joe Smith was no slouch catching the football out of the backfield and he could take it upfield with power. What we got with Roberts and Logan was two scatback types and we dressed Roberts every game he was able to play in. If we would have done the same with Smith, we could have utilized Smith as a blocker when we wanted to insert him on second down, used him to run or pass to him in those situations to keep the defence off balance, and used him for short yardage and down at the goal line. Smith/Logan gave us way more options than did Roberts/Logan.

If we wanted to jettison Joe Smith, we should have done it at the end of last season and utilized his talents until then....he would have given us much more....I still think it was a head scratcher too..........one of the most confusing trades in Leo history....

This trade didn't add up for me either and I can't recall a trade as poor as this one. Smith was a good football player here and it was a surprise that the Lions success with Dorazio-Kruck and the running game was jettisoned about as foolishly as they dumped Smith.

When they were so were adamant that Smith and Logan could not be on the field together it was appalling to me that they decided hey, we can use two scat backs at the same time neither of whom could be as effective as a blocker as Smith or Green or Lumbala even. This trade for me pretty much summed up how the season ended. It was botched up.

[Shi Zi Mi]

Sadly......it's all about perception.

The media jumped all over Smith's indifference to watching games on TV and translated that to "no passion" for the game/team.......the media then took the Bobby Ackles' tribute miss as proof of this..........but never, ever, did Smith show indifference or a lack of passion on the field.

It's sad that Buono bowed to the media pressure, created the bogus excuses why Smith didn't fit in and then gave him away.

......and people wonder why I have such a lack of respect for the media.

[Ballistic Bob]

Sadly......it's all about perception.

The media jumped all over Smith's indifference to watching games on TV and translated that to "no passion" for the game/team.......the media then took the Bobby Ackles' tribute miss as proof of this..........but never, ever, did Smith show indifference or a lack of passion on the field.

It's sad that Buono bowed to the media pressure, created the bogus excuses why Smith didn't fit in and then gave him away.

......and people wonder why I have such a lack of respect for the media.

Hi Lloyd I think Buono succumbed to Brayleys presssure on the no show at Bobs tribute. BB

[Toppy Vann]

Sadly......it's all about perception.

The media jumped all over Smith's indifference to watching games on TV and translated that to "no passion" for the game/team.......the media then took the Bobby Ackles' tribute miss as proof of this..........but never, ever, did Smith show indifference or a lack of passion on the field.

It's sad that Buono bowed to the media pressure, created the bogus excuses why Smith didn't fit in and then gave him away.

......and people wonder why I have such a lack of respect for the media.

Hi Lloyd I think Buono succumbed to Brayleys presssure on the no show at Bobs tribute. BB

You guys are both probably right and we may never know until Wally writes a book.

For me changing mid year was a high risk that wasn't worth taking as it takes times for players to adjust to new plays and the Lions didn't need that last year as they were in a battle that wasn't won.

I heard absolutely nothing from the Lions players that would allow you to read between the lines that he was a distraction to his team or teammates. Geroy certainly stood up repeatedly for him in the media and refuted any hint of distraction.

Not sure Shi Zi Mi that we can blame the media as Joe not attending that game was a fact that they would never ever ignore. Even Joe's latest comments that he didn't know the new coach are comments that he should not be making if he has learned anything at all from his banishment to Winnipeg mid season. He needs to be a lot smoother and not make comments that could make others think he has no passion for the game or his team. It is a bit disrespectful if you look at the need for players to help promote the CFL and their team to generate fan interest. As Milt Stegall used to say to other players those fans buy tickets so we don't have to get other jobs or words to that effect.

For me, I look negatively at the Bombers for dumping Charles Roberts mid season after all he had done for that franchise over the years when he could have gone free agency and left on his accord. He stayed loyal as did Stegall through some bad years when he was still a player that most teams would have grabbed immediately. To me they should have waited for year end and told him that it was over and given him a chance to retire or choose to seek another team. It struck me that dumping Charles is not what former players said at their 75th Anniversary about wearing "Bomber blue. Granted Doug Berry was grasping at straws and had issues with Roberts and probably thought that Smith could light it up even mid year (which is naivete on his part).

It might not have been the owner but the GM himself who couldn't stomach Joe Smith missing the game the night they honoured Bobby Ackles after.

[pointguard2376]

the running back position is my favorite in the game...I am always focused on them, much like I am with the Point Guard Position in Professional Basketball, these guys have such great vision, it is amazing what they do day in day out.

[Shi Zi Mi]

Sadly......it's all about perception.

The media jumped all over Smith's indifference to watching games on TV and translated that to "no passion" for the game/team.......the media then took the Bobby Ackles' tribute miss as proof of this..........but never, ever, did Smith show indifference or a lack of passion on the field.

It's sad that Buono bowed to the media pressure, created the bogus excuses why Smith didn't fit in and then gave him away.

......and people wonder why I have such a lack of respect for the media.

Hi Lloyd I think Buono succumbed to Brayleys presssure on the no show at Bobs tribute. BB

You guys are both probably right and we may never know until Wally writes a book.

For me changing mid year was a high risk that wasn't worth taking as it takes times for players to adjust to new plays and the Lions didn't need that last year as they were in a battle that wasn't won.

I heard absolutely nothing from the Lions players that would allow you to read between the lines that he was a distraction to his team or teammates. Geroy certainly stood up repeatedly for him in the media and refuted any hint of distraction.

Not sure Shi Zi Mi that we can blame the media as Joe not attending that game was a fact that they would never ever ignore. Even Joe's latest comments that he didn't know the new coach are comments that he should not be making if he has learned anything at all from his banishment to Winnipeg mid season. He needs to be a lot smoother and not make comments that could make others think he has no passion for the game or his team. It is a bit disrespectful if you look at the need for players to help promote the CFL and their team to generate fan interest. As Milt Stegall used to say to other players those fans buy tickets so we don't have to get other jobs or words to that effect.

For me, I look negatively at the Bombers for dumping Charles Roberts mid season after all he had done for that franchise over the years when he could have gone free agency and left on his accord. He stayed loyal as did Stegall through some bad years when he was still a player that most teams would have grabbed immediately. To me they should have waited for year end and told him that it was over and given him a chance to retire or choose to seek another team. It struck me that dumping Charles is not what former players said at their 75th Anniversary about wearing "Bomber blue. Granted Doug Berry was grasping at straws and had issues with Roberts and probably thought that Smith could light it up even mid year (which is naivete on his part).

It might not have been the owner but the GM himself who couldn't stomach Joe Smith missing the game the night they honoured Bobby Ackles after.

What I have noticed is standard procedure in these types of incidents...........the media learns something that MAY be interpreted as distasteful to the masses........everyone and their dog in the media writes a negative article about the situation (because negative sells papers)......everyone involved with the team (players/coaches/front office/management/ownership) downplays the situation usually saying there is nothing wrong or there is no problem.......the media, like a dog with a bone, are relentless at picking away and trying to get someone to say something negative......and if they can't find something, they make something up.

This has occurred many times in regards to the Lions.......but the Printers debacle was easily the best example of the media at their absolute worst.

[Hambone]

To say the media harping about Smith missing Ackles' tribute influenced the trade I think does two things, neither of them good.
1) It gives faaaaaaaaaaaaaaarrrr too much credit to the media for being an influence in personnel decisions by pro sports teams.
2) By saying Buono lets himself be influenced by the media I think is a significant discredit to his integrity.

When it gets down to it media can generate controversy in the eyes of the armchair GMs, but it tends to sail in one ear and out the other for the GMs and coaches on the team's payroll. Both teams were struggling at the time of the deal and in need of some sort of shakeup.
BC Lions were 4-5 before the trade and 7-2 after.
Winnipeg was 2-7 before the trade and 6-3 after.
Combined: 6-12 pre-trade; 13-5 post-trade.
One can argue about if Smith was being used properly or not but one cannot argue that both teams played much better after the deal. I think by the time of the deal Buono had determined that Smith and his contract would not be a part of the 2009 Lion and that had far more to do with Logan's emergence than Smith himself. With that in mind the trade was all about improving the team for the balance of the 2008 season. While it didn't produce a Grey Cup it certainly can't be denied that the team was better after the deal. Lots of "ifs and buts" but if the Lions stay plugging along at the .444 pace they are into a cross-over and even that may have been at risk had the Argos not gone 1-11 down the stretch.

[Shi Zi Mi]

To say the media harping about Smith missing Ackles' tribute influenced the trade I think does two things, neither of them good.
1) It gives faaaaaaaaaaaaaaarrrr too much credit to the media for being an influence in personnel decisions by pro sports teams.
2) By saying Buono lets himself be influenced by the media I think is a significant discredit to his integrity.

When it gets down to it media can generate controversy in the eyes of the armchair GMs, but it tends to sail in one ear and out the other for the GMs and coaches on the team's payroll. Both teams were struggling at the time of the deal and in need of some sort of shakeup.
BC Lions were 4-5 before the trade and 7-2 after.
Winnipeg was 2-7 before the trade and 6-3 after.
Combined: 6-12 pre-trade; 13-5 post-trade.
One can argue about if Smith was being used properly or not but one cannot argue that both teams played much better after the deal. I think by the time of the deal Buono had determined that Smith and his contract would not be a part of the 2009 Lion and that had far more to do with Logan's emergence than Smith himself. With that in mind the trade was all about improving the team for the balance of the 2008 season. While it didn't produce a Grey Cup it certainly can't be denied that the team was better after the deal. Lots of "ifs and buts" but if the Lions stay plugging along at the .444 pace they are into a cross-over and even that may have been at risk had the Argos not gone 1-11 down the stretch.

I disagree about Buono wanting to jettison Smith and his contract.........Buono broke protocol (for him) and offered Smith a lucrative contract in the off season just a couple months before Smith was to become a FA......that was unusual for Buono who normally will allow a player to test the FA market before extending his final offer. In my mind, that means Smith was the long term plan.....now the arrival of Logan, changed things somewhat, but trading Smith for Charles Roberts did nothing to help the cap situation and the risk to negatively affect team chemistry was far greater than keeping Smith......so why did Buono do it?

We know the "can't keep both in the same backfield" excuse was total BS......so that only leaves that Buono bowed to the media pressure.......he is just a man after all.