Bombers-Lions: The Showdown

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Walt67
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David wrote:
Fri Oct 06, 2023 11:13 pm
I am concerned that the way we lost this game could have a detrimental effect on the club down the stretch.

To have the win (in the biggest game of the season) in the palm of their hands only be snatched away by poor clock awareness to lose in OT may be something they never recover from. Quite debilitating.


DH :cool:
Once amazingly rare, now last-minute comebacks seem to be the norm in the innovative time-clock CFL. Watching the Lions offence deflate like a limp balloon in the second half - and knowing how CFL comebacks work - it was sadly not surprising to see the momentum-stoked Bombers get all the points they needed in the last two minutes - and then stuff the bewildered Lions in OT. Can you hear that laughter rolling in from the prairies?
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KnowItAll
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Walt67 wrote:
Sat Oct 07, 2023 12:03 am


Can you hear that laughter rolling in from the prairies?
I can hear that damn chant
Every day that passes is one you can't get back
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SammyGreene
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Now looking at the highlights and Hatcher will have some explaining to do in the film room on how he quit on Rhymes near winning TD instead of blocking Parker from making the game saving tackle. Of course, maybe he thought Rhymes would go down to set up the game winning FG? 😞
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Buck Pierce outcoached Jordan Myksmic
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cromartie
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cromartie wrote:
Tue Oct 03, 2023 6:51 am
Walt67 wrote:
Sat Sep 30, 2023 6:40 pm
Otherwise, you don't need to be a soothsayer to see the Lions finishing second again, winning the semi, and then being crushed on the Manitoba tundra.
The way you counter against this is by playing keep away with the ball when you have it on offense, something this offense is not designed to do (though it has the personnel to do so). As I don't expect us to figure this out offensively, you can pick your poison and resign yourself to this exact scenario now to save yourself the disappointment later.
No need to thank me. I’ll show myself out.
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It was a heartbreaking overtime loss to the Winnipeg Blue Bombers in a game that likely means our Leos will not win the West, or get a playoff bye, or have a home date for the Western Final, if we even get to that point. There were a lot of opportunities for our Leos to win this contest and a lot of reasons why we didn’t.

Here are some post-game thoughts.

FOR BETTER

When Jevon Cottoy made his 70-yard catch and run to give our Leos a 17-3 first half lead, it was a much better than the start I had hoped for. Vernon Adams was firing bullets, our receivers were finding open areas, and our offence was in sync. Maksymic was wise not to try to run the football a lot on first down, with the always juking and jiving, but never gaining or diving for good yardage, Mizzell.

Vernon Adams generated a whopping 252 passing yards by half time, Dominique Rhymes was dialed in, as were all our receivers, and Terry Williams excellent punt return with only seconds remaining in the first half, gave us another shot at a field goal with time running out in the first half. Once again Sean Whyte delivered.

On the last play of the game, Rhymes outstanding catch and run did not have the heroic outcome it should have. Had Rhymes gone down immediately or sooner, Whyte could have kicked the winning field goal. But instinct took over and the clock ran out on what could have been a mind blowing finish. However, the game should not have come down to our Leos offence needing a huge pass play with seconds ticking away in the contest, in order to have the chance to win the game.

Key turnovers kept us in the contest. Sione Teuhema recovered two Collaros fumbles, one strip sack by Teuhema himself and the other created by Betts were key plays that kept us in the contest.

FOR WORSE

Our Leos blew this game in a number of ways and did not deserve to win. First of all, a team who wants to be a champion does not let the opposing team run a simple bootleg play very successfully, over and over again, for almost an entire game. Before this game I posted that our Leos needed to send an extra blitzer to Collaros right side, as he liked to boot and fade to that side.

It’s a simple play, with the tailback heading towards the flat area and the Bombers slot receivers running stop patterns inside and wideouts running skinny corner or outs towards the sidelines. The bootleg play cuts off the Bombers offence to one side of the field and Collaros is not a huge threat to keep the football and run. Yet time and time again, Buck Pierce called the play because time and time again, Phillips defense had no clue how to defend the play until very late in the game.
A championship team should be built on sound defense and giving up 389 yards of passing and 127 yds. of rushing (6.4 yds per carry) is just not good enough. Championship defenses don’t give up 487 yds. of offence or be unable to scheme and defend a bootleg play that almost every high school football team runs.

The Bombers missed an early makeable field goal, Collaros bobbled a snap in the red zone negating a potential Bombers touchdown drive and had an interception and two turnovers. Without those mistakes, the Bombers would have scored a lot more points, as their offence looked like a powerful pro machine playing a small college team. It looked like men vs. boys. At no point in time did it look like our defense could stop them unless we caused a turnover or unless Collaros made a big mistake.

We won the turnover battle in this game but little else.

Offensively, it was the two Vernon’s and I could not recognize the second half Vernon Adams from the first half Vernon Adams, as they were two different quarterbacks. |First Half Vernon’ came out throwing confidently and accurately. He threw strikes with velocity. He looked almost unstoppable. But Second Half Vernon looked like he had been put on some half time music and listened to Abba’s Dancing Queen and Donna Summer’s Disco Inferno ‘man’. Instead of continuing to throw, he decided he was on the dance floor of Saturday Night Fever, dancing and prancing between blitzers before giving up huge yardage on sacks.

He could have thrown the football away. He has Cottoy on every pass play, usually on a short route, as a huge and reliable target. Whether Vernon got afraid to throw an interception with the lead or whether Vernon got afraid to have an interception ruin his MOP opportunity, or whether Vernon decided to show off his footwork and escapability to the MOP voters, we will never know. But there is something seriously wrong that a quarterback who throws for 252 yards in one half and then only for 53 yards before the last pass play to Rhymes. Yes the Bombers made adjustments, rushing three often and mixing in effective blitzes in the second half.

But the answer is more inside Vernon Adams than anywhere else. Worse he has no clue ‘man’. “We definitely weren’t clicking. I don’t even know if I had a completed pass,” a perplexed Adams said post-game. “I don’t know what happened. We can’t do that to a good team like that, man” was Adams post game response.

But blame for this loss does not just fall on the players. For most of this season, astute fans have realized that Mizzell does not cut it as a CFL level tailback. He had an average of 3.8 yds. per carry in this contest and we were wise to use him as little as we did. But he should not have been on the field in the first place.

Our Leos had time this season to bring in an NFL cut. We could have at least given Mackie a chance to carry the mail. Mackie is 250 pounds and he is athletic. He can block and he can catch. A Mackie/LaFrance combination would have paid more dividends than Mizzell, who can’t run and can’t block. I almost laughed during the game when we set up a purrfect screen play for Mizzell and he somehow managed to juke himself into a defender on what should have been a big gain.

Our coaching staff also had more than enough evidence that Dominque Davis should not be our short yardage quarterback. Yet we stayed with him knowing how useless he as at third down sneak plays. I used to be so very critical of Wally’ personal coaching of the Jumbo team. Wally would yell “Jumbo” and I would yell ‘Dumbo” because Wally would run short yardage up the gut each and every time and we were stopped short very often, with Wally blowing his usual fuse.

Well, its been another 'Dumb and Dumber' or 'Stupid is as Stupid Does' scenario with Campbell and Davis in terms of short yardage coaching. To add misery to the equation, we motion a fly sweep but wait until the fly sweep is no longer an option before sneaking the football. The defense ignores the offensive player in motion. We eliminate a potential blocker while the defense gets an extra defender at the line of scrimmage. Duh! We did not make the third and one yard sneak and to me, that was the key play of the game.

PURGATORY

For the most part the refs let the teams play, as they should for such a pivotal contest. There should have been calls on the Bombers for a hit to the head on Adams, for a hit on Adams out of bounds, and Adams also looked like he had attained first down yardage before the ill fated quarterback sneak late in the fourth quarter. The pass interference call on Bagayogo late led to a Bombers touchdown, instead of a field goal and it looked like it should have been a non-call, based on being far away from the play and accidental contact.

A play that almost could go by the radar screen but should not was Flintoff’s kickoff going out of bounds with a 17-3 lead. It gave the Bombers the football at almost mid-field and they quickly scored a touchdown. In big games those kinds of mistakes cost dearly.

WRAP

Our Leos are a passing team and not well designed for a playoff date on the frozen tundra of Winnipeg. We will have to win a playoff semi-final to even get the opportunity. It’s a tough loss but as long as there is another opportunity, hope remains alive.
"When I went to Catholic high school in Philadelphia, we just had one coach for football and basketball. He took all of us who turned out and had us run through a forest. The ones who ran into the trees were on the football team". (George Raveling)
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SammyGreene
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What a great read Blitz! So glad you are back.

What a complete waste of time Davis is at this stage of career. Almost laziness on the Lions’ recruiting efforts not to find an athletic young QB to use in those situations instead of signing a 34 year old as a supposed short yardage specialist. Pipkin was better a year ago coming off the scrap heap.
Walt67
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SammyGreene wrote:
Sat Oct 07, 2023 8:22 am
What a great read Blitz! So glad you are back.

What a complete waste of time Davis is at this stage of career. Almost laziness on the Lions’ recruiting efforts not to find an athletic young QB to use in those situations instead of signing a 34 year old as a supposed short yardage specialist. Pipkin was better a year ago coming off the scrap heap.
Yes, a QB who could have gained a single yard in the 4th quarter would have almost certainly yielded a win. Not having a spread formation didn't help either.
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swervynmerv
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Very disappointing and you could see this coming mid way through the 3rd quarter the way the Bombers were moving the ball and BC wasn’t. If it wasn’t for the two Collaros fumbles in the red zone, this game probably isn’t even close.

We haven’t had a real running threat since we lost Andrew Harris. I don’t understand why. Everyone that follows the CFL knows that the weather turns in the fall and very few teams ever win the Grey Cup without a solid running game. The Bombers, like the Lions,have a potent aerial attack but they balance it with a bruising Olivera and running plays using Demski out of the backfield all night. The Lions had no answer to it.

Every down can’t be a 5 alarm fire with Adams scrambling around and making unbelievable plays. Sure it’s fun to watch but against the top teams, you need to execute a better game plan.

It has been mentioned about the Lions penchant for stinking out the joint when it’s a big game or large crowd. It happens too often for my liking.

We should get another crack at the Bombers in the WF but part of me has a gut feeling that they will lose to the Riders at home in the WSF. The Riders always play BC tough, even when they aren’t a very good team.

The Lions are a decent team and have provided some excellent entertainment for the fans this year. I just don’t see them winning it all this year. The Bombers exposed their warts last night and everything would have to fall in to place for them to be in Hamilton GC Sunday.
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Hey man, Vernon Adams seem to have very poor situational awareness. He is so focuses on what is happening downfield he is oblivious to the fact that the protection is breaking down. Next thing you know he's lying in a dog pile staring at the sky. Happens every game. You know what I'm saying ?
OV:54-40
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Out-coached, fell apart in the 2nd half.

Adams is just not always on his A game - not sure if he can be counted on to put together a full game in a big game. Great receiving corps, but agree with Blitz about Mizzell - mediocre at best (as was Butler really IMO), and the OC doesn't grasp what a ground game can do anyways; given up on Mackie being deployed smartly, another thing they don't get.

D front 7 is just not good enough against the run - need a run stuffing DT; and why is Lokombo - a vet, smart, play-making defender not playing regular reps at LB ??? Lots of weak spots in the secondary to give up pass yards - Lee & Peters are good vets, but a play-making safety (like young kid did on that pick of Collaros) would really help.

Gonna be real tough to go into Winnipeg and win in a maybe cold or sloppy field play-off game - with this coaching staff and their lack of game plan & calling smarts and continuing to play weak coach fave players.
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Toppy Vann
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SammyGreene wrote:
Sat Oct 07, 2023 12:01 am
The 2 defying plays for me were the Teuhema return to the Winnipeg 31 after the Baron sack and the offence doing absolutely nothing with it where another TD would have stretched the lead to 14.

Then our 34 year old 3rd stringer not picking up the 1st down on 3rd down with the game in our hands. We needed probably 2 or 3 1st downs and instead gift wrapped the Bombers the ball on the BC 50.

This is another gut punch to the team’s philosophy that its passing game is so good it can overcome an offence that is very one dimensional and spends a good chunk of their salary cap on receivers. For it to have a chance it needs the path to the Grey Cup played in ideal conditions at BC Place, not on a frozen field in Winnipeg where they are destined for a 2nd straight year.

The hype all week about the attendance sure didn’t match the final number. Seems to me there are a good chunk of end zone seats that are counted as sold but really are not ( Save On Foods section?).

Also would like to know how Bo Lokombo has become almost a complete after thought for the 2nd straight year after missing time with an injury. Is our defence really better with him in a minimal role?
I bought my 3 tickets BEFORE the Saskatchewan home game off Travelzoo's deal in S204, Row K and it showed mostly sold out then in that entire section. Yet behind us seemed to missing folks. I too was surprised that it was just 23K plus there.

While we can fault Dominique Davis on the short yardage as I have several times this year this OLine is not developed for run blocking.
Bombers Prokup isn't always successful on short yardage but they do different things keeping the DEF thinking vs BC where it's 99% probably straight ahead.

The break down on the OT TD by Brady Oliveira should have been stopped as the def alignment was there.

Dominique Davis- at the game I cheered him on as I was sure it was a TD to win.
I looked at the replay this morning and it's very likely (forgetting he hadn't grasped to get down as he hadn't heard that said) that he did the right thing.

Seconds Left:
8
7 - VA is looking for a target
4 - Rhymes is at the 46 yd line and still turned bringing in the catch.
3 - at the 40
2 is he's at the 35 to 30
1 Rhymes is at the 25

Even if he was told to get down by the time he had the ball and turned and during the time even Farhan said TD on the broadcast, it's likely Rhymes is thinking TD not selfishly but it was there for him.

If he went down at the 35-30 the FG was more likely a gimme.

I'm assuming Rhymes would have no idea if he had time left as he was so focused on the TD.

If he went down at the 25, how would know there was still time on the clock in that moment.

He had no idea there was a second shooter on the grassy knoll.

Conclusion: he did the right thing.
When he was bringing the ball in and still turned
"Ability without character will lose." - Marv Levy
OV:54-40
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Rhymes could not only have - with proper coaching instruction - got down to kill the clock for a game winning FG try; OR he - easily had time & space to punt the ball into the end zone - where it could even roll out the back line for a rouge = game over, and no possibility of a FG miss or block.
Blitz
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What a complete waste of time Davis is at this stage of career. Almost laziness on the Lions’ recruiting efforts not to find an athletic young QB to use in those situations instead of signing a 34 year old as a supposed short yardage specialist. Pipkin was better a year ago coming off the scrap heap.
We discussed this earlier in the season Sammy. I completely agree that its a complete waste to have a 34 year old 3rd string quarterback in a position that should be a developmental role but at least it could be partially justified if Davis could actually effectively run a quarterback sneak, which he has proven over and over again that he can't.

ll we had to do is get one yard on the quarterback sneak and the odds would have been much in our favor.
OV:54-40 wrote: why is Lokombo - a vet, smart, play-making defender not playing regular reps at LB ???
I'm flabbergasted once again when it comes to our Leos and Lokombo. I watched Woods all game and no way he is as good as Lokombo, who was our second leading defensive tackler going into this game, even though he missed games due to injury. Lokombo is also a very good pass cover linebacker too.
"When I went to Catholic high school in Philadelphia, we just had one coach for football and basketball. He took all of us who turned out and had us run through a forest. The ones who ran into the trees were on the football team". (George Raveling)
OV:54-40
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Blitz wrote:
Sat Oct 07, 2023 11:30 am
What a complete waste of time Davis is at this stage of career. Almost laziness on the Lions’ recruiting efforts not to find an athletic young QB to use in those situations instead of signing a 34 year old as a supposed short yardage specialist. Pipkin was better a year ago coming off the scrap heap.
We discussed this earlier in the season Sammy. I completely agree that its a complete waste to have a 34 year old 3rd string quarterback in a position that should be a developmental role but at least it could be partially justified if Davis could actually effectively run a quarterback sneak, which he has proven over and over again that he can't.

ll we had to do is get one yard on the quarterback sneak and the odds would have been much in our favor.
OV:54-40 wrote: why is Lokombo - a vet, smart, play-making defender not playing regular reps at LB ???
I'm flabbergasted once again when it comes to our Leos and Lokombo. I watched Woods all game and no way he is as good as Lokombo, who was our second leading defensive tackler going into this game, even though he missed games due to injury. Lokombo is also a very good pass cover linebacker too.
I'd have to guess Woods has the preferred passport to the main decision makers in the coaching staff, and if they already have their 7 only Canadian starters elsewhere, they will defer to Americans playing; we talked about McInnis vs. Whitehead in the receiving corps; or Mackie never getting the ball; tailback is an American only position as well.

And Lokombo played safety (and quite well) for the Als a few years back; he could be a moving part in the D to confuse QB reads, along with being a smart play-maker on D and very good tackler/ big hitter.
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