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Both Glen Suitor & Matt Dunnigan think so:

On the #BCLions, @MattDuniganTSN: "I see guys quitting. I saw a guy quit a couple of weeks ago. And basically walk off the football field when the play was still going on. You can't have that." #CFL #BCLions via @DonnieandTheMoj 1/2

If that's allowed and that's not addressed, & that guy's still in uniform the following week, I think that wears on what's going on in the locker room."

Glen Suitor:

There was a player who completely quit on a play that I saw in Winnipeg. I thought, if he starts again, they have a problem. If you continue to play him, as a coaching staff, the integrity in that room is gone.. That's part of the issue w/ #BCLions." - @GlenSuitor #CFL 1/2

It's a severe criticism, but I saw it (a #BCLions player completely quit on a play in Winnipeg and then played the next week at home vs. the #Ticats)." - @GlenSuitor #CFL

I think Lions problems run deep and if what these guts say are true and I don't doubt them it probably is a reason they are 1 and 8. To Claybrooks is too much a buddy to his players than a coach and lets them gets away with quitting on plays with no consequences.






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I'm sure that some of them have probably hit rock bottom in the caring dept. You can only lose so much before you start to despair. You lose faith in the coaches, you lose faith in your teammates and faith in yourself. I'm not saying it is right but frankly, players quitting on the plays at this point is really just a symptom. Sure you can fire players and so on but really the issues go much deeper. This season is basically a test of who might survive till next year and with the performance of this team, there are going to be a lot of personnel both players and coaches that are done regardless, it won't really matter how hard you try. Being a marginal player on the worst team in the leagues doesn't give you many job options come next year. You could be playing your heart out but the stink of this team is going to stick with everyone for a good long while and I wouldn't be surprised if some players who otherwise might be able to find a place on another team have an uphill battle.

If a player is quitting on a play he should be cut immediately. Keeping guys like that around are how you get a toxic locker room.

I'm also at the point now where I would fire Devone Claybrooks, although with the coaches cap I'm not sure if that's a viable option. Perhaps demoting him to DC, but he's clearly lost the room at this point and that's not something that I think can be fixed. The Lions lack leadership on the field and on the sidelines and that's a major problem.

I understand a player being frustrated with the situation, coaching or lack of it, lack of leadership etc., but quitting on a play, or on the team, or coach is very dangerous territory for a player because everything is on tape.

Players should at this point be playing for next year's contract if a free agent in 2020, or put in the extra effort to gain trade value for the off season (or even this season) if big changes take place as they likely will.

With this news coming out it just makes the Lions look bad and right now they have hit rock bottom. Claybrooks coming out and saying they will do a full examination also could make him look bad if Lions end up doing nothing after the examination is complete. Why come out and say this in the media? If they do nothing they will question the integrity of the coach for the team is 1 and 9. To save face Lions almost have to do something now or else the words are just talk. At 1 and 9, the whole team is a failure and no one cares about doing an examination if no action follows it.

Talk of a full examination or self-examination is common during a midseason bye. Wally Buono said the same things. I don’t expect much to happen this time. It’s too late to cut most veterans. And the coaching cap makes it difficult to fire non-playing personnel. Any changes will have to come from the same group of players and coaches who got themselves into this hole.

I think the headline and story were largely overblown. So one player gave up on a play in Winnipeg and now it's "Lions players quit on team!"

That's BS.

Not big on these kinds of media accusations without revealing who they're talking about or at least describing what happened. Details. Sure, the players may all know from watching film, but maybe it has been dealt with privately. This kind of thing can erode consumer confidence and lead to speculation. It's unfair to the team (and Duron Carter because, guaranteed, 90% of people reading/listening to this story will assume it's him).


DH

David wrote: ↑

Tue Aug 27, 2019 11:01 pm

I think the headline and story were largely overblown. So one player gave up on a play in Winnipeg and now it's "Lions players quit on team!"

That's BS.

Not big on these kinds of media accusations without revealing who they're talking about or at least describing what happened. Details. Sure, the players may all know from watching film, but maybe it has been dealt with privately. This kind of thing can erode consumer confidence and lead to speculation. It's unfair to the team (and Duron Carter because, guaranteed, 90% of people reading/listening to this story will assume it's him).


DH

I might have missed Dunigan saying this but I have heard Suitor with his innuendo on radio on how post game he went to the truck and looked at iso cameras and concluded a player quit on a play in WPG. Given his radio rants which lately have been poor he was ragging on Carter. I'm losing a bit of respect for Suitor as he comes across as just another lazy broadcaster who is not providing anything in-depth.

IF there are players quitting on plays these media guys suggesting dumping them are missing the freaking point. IF it is that bad coaches have to be finding out why.

If there has been 'quitting' I'd suggest look at some of that horrid ST play where one guy gives up 4 15 yd penalties on punt cover!

Still think Lions will begin bringing guys in to play this year from the NFL cuts for nothing to lose now and might as well audition them now. And they will cut some guys. At 1 and 9, you cannot remain status quo and keep losing game after game. I expect there to be 2 or 3 changes before the Montreal game.

JohnnyMusso wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 28, 2019 8:16 am

Still think Lions will begin bringing guys in to play this year from the NFL cuts for nothing to lose now and might as well audition them now. And they will cut some guys. At 1 and 9, you cannot remain status quo and keep losing game after game. I expect there to be 2 or 3 changes before the Montreal game.

Absolutely!!!!!

In this situation you have to change the mix and the chemistry when it's clear that this group can't get it done.

However, if it's just the usual suspects who are chosen for victimhood because the media and fans will be onside rather than those who genuinely aren't capable of performing in this mix then it might give you a short term pass - but won't change the results.

This is on the GM - put too much $$$$ into the QB having to dump ST players and leaders like Rolly L earning $160K as the GM said and not signing DEF leaders like Sol E.

Getting that OLine together as a group is now more of a problem as the new contact rules prevent the one on ones like done in the past.

I do think that schemes and play calling need a look. Rarely is JJ singled out for calling a good game.

OR the GM brings in now former Bomber Chris Mathews and gives the fans what they want - toss Carter. Or, like me the coaches finally take the view that Carter is a talent that they have to find a way to employ and move him around. Some players have to be involved to be at the top of their game - he is one of them. He can make spectacular catches in practice but slow pass routes as the Lions have them means he is not open deep fast enough (not turned) when Reilly needs to throw. Reilly is in rush shock these days.

https://3downnation.com/2019/08/28/bomb ... s-mathews/

Chris Mathews is a very good receiver and shocked he has been cut especially before their big games with the Riders.

I for one hope Lions sign him. Lions fans keep hoping for Carter to shine, but he has only shown flashes of his old self. After 10 games it is not going to happen. I think he is gone after this year, so might as well go after Matthews before another team like Ottawa or Toronto does. Sign him for this year with an option for next year. He can do no worse than Carter who has basically done nothing this year, except for that long throw a few games back.

JohnnyMusso wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 28, 2019 10:03 am

Chris Mathews is a very good receiver and shocked he has been cut especially before their big games with the Riders.

I for one hope Lions sign him. Lions fans keep hoping for Carter to shine, but he has only shown flashes of his old self. After 10 games it is not going to happen. I think he is gone after this year, so might as well go after Matthews before another team like Ottawa or Toronto does. Sign him for this year with an option for next year. He can do no worse than Carter who has basically done nothing this year, except for that long throw a few games back.

From a fan point of view, dumping Carter would make them happy much like how happy fans were when the Lions signed Mike Reilly.

Matthews is being trashed by a few posters in the Peg as having done nothing this year and some restaurant incident is leading them to accept that it's "good riddance".

But one team's garbage is another team's treasure.

Ryan Lankford is a good example.

Just like a different QB (unless it was Fajardo who could run for his life) won't fix the Lions problem dumping Carter won't either.

But victims are always a way out for teams and Carter is low pickings.

IF I were the GM, and they couldn't find a way to make a talent like that get involved I'm be firing my OC.

Toppy Vann wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 28, 2019 10:41 am

But victims are always a way out for teams and Carter is low pickings.

IF I were the GM, and they couldn't find a way to make a talent like that get involved I'm be firing my OC.

I've wondered about the deployment of Carter and if he's being put in a position to succeed. I expected him to add a bit of a game-breaking aspect that would help open up things for others. Seems though they continually try to get him the ball either on a flanker screen or out on the flat and expect him to make some moves or break tackles for YAC. When they do go deep it seems like he has to make some sort of circus catch on the sidelines to come up with the ball.

In his brief stay in Toronto last year his average per catch was 11.9. Prior to that his career worst was 13.7 in his second season in Montreal. Right now he's at 8.7 with BC. He has 38 catches for 329 yards including 109 YAC. Subtract the YAC and divide the 220 by 38 and you come up with only 5.8. On average on receptions he's getting the ball less than 6 yards downfield from the line of scrimmage. In his previous full seasons in Saskatchewan and Montreal where YAC stats exist he was getting the ball 10.5 yards downfield.

Hambone:

Some of the layered pass routes that I see in practice don't have their deep guys turning early - except Burnham does turn earlier than Carter. Same with shorter routes where they use Carter to block. Wherever they move Carter the DEF keys on him even more than Burnham but the Lions have some new stuff with more than just Carter - yet we only see tidbits of it.

Suitor isn't going to win any Pulitzers, but the fact that both he and Dunigan pointed this out as a serious problem that is undermining the coaches leads me to believe that the player's action was egregious. Just another sign that our coaches are inadequate.

Nobody would be surprised if it was Carter, but could well be someone else.

Carter hasn't had a 100 yard game in 2 seasons, during which time he has played with 3 teams. Maybe it's schemes. Maybe Reilly doesn't like him. Maybe he is lazy. It doesn't really matter. The bottom line is he has made little positive impact for any of these teams. I've never been a fan of his goofy antics, but hoped to see him succeed here. Now I want him gone so that I stop wasting a pick on him in TSN Fantasy.