Ticket Prices / Lions' Marketing

[Blue In BC]

Another two factors not under the control of the Lions but influencing fans attendance:

1. Parking prices have risen in the past few seasons form $8 to $30
2. Parking lot owners have largelytaken away the opportunity of Tailgates which was / can be a significant part of the game experience.

While I never participated much in the BBQ'ing process, I did enjoy meeting people at the tailgates. Since the change in the parking policies in both these areas, I have attended less live games.

I suppose I can afford the changes but in principal I feel as though I'm being gouged / used.

BTW: increase in food costs is beyond any percieved change in quality.

Bottom line is costs have risen more than cost of inflation.

[B.C.FAN]

I don't buy the price argument. My $26 season ticket ($31.50 with taxes and fees) is right by the field and parking prices just outside the stadium have come down slightly to $20 or $25, which is better than at Empire and with more transit options. A seaon's ticket is a bargain compared to other entertainment options.

It's early but attendance in the first seven games of 2012 is stable throughout the league at an average of 26,252 (compared to 26,374 in 2011), while Lions attendance through two games is up an average of nearly 4,000 to 27,230 (compared to 26,374 in 2011). The move to Empire cut into the fan base. It is starting to come back, judging by B.C. Place attendance at the end of 2011 and the start of 2012. I don't expect to see regular season crowds of 40,000 but an average of 30,000 to 35,000 is quite feasible and probabkly quite profitable.

[Luke]

I think I agree with BCFan. When I was watching on TV, it certainly looked like the empty seats are in the end-zones and the corners instead of behind the benches. If ticket prices were the problem shouldn't the expensive mid-field seats be a little emptier, and shouldn't the cheaper end-zone and corner seats be more full?

[Belize City Lion]

I've said this before, but the Lions should be looking at this time to invest in growing their ticket buying fan base rather than simply maximizing the revenue they can extract from their current customers. One of the big mistakes they made was not LOWERING ticket prices when they moved back to BC Place. Most people understand supply and demand, and once the excitement over the "new" stadium wears off people will begin to question why they are paying more for tickets when there is a much greater supply available. Sure there's a nice big video screen and a hole in the roof, but people pay for the product on the field. The fact that there are nearly twice as many seats for sale is what pays for those perks.

The Lions have painted themselves into a corner for this year. They can't lower prices now without appearing desperate, or pissing off everyone who already paid season's tickets. But what they can do is roll back ticket prices for next year, and impose a moratorium on price increases for a few years to come. As Vancouver sports fans watch the Canucks increase prices year after year, the Lions will start to look like the family friendly entertainment option they used to be.

The fact is the CFL will never reach the level of the NHL in Canada or the NFL in the USA where teams can charge a ridiculous amount of money for tickets and there will be a waiting list of suckers willing to pay. It's just not going to happen, nor should it. That is not what the CFL is about. Sounds like the Lions need to get back to those roots.

[Blue In BC]

Even at $20 for parking if you can find it, that's still 2 1/2 times what it was in 2009 IIRC.

My ticket at the last game on the 10 yard line was $73 more or less. That's a non season ticket price. When I had season tickets on the 20 - 25 yard line, I was paying about $23 per ticket.

I understand single game tickets are more expensive but they are pushing prices high for many people. I would have prefered closer to the 35 or 40 ayrd line. Problem is lack of availability on the lower level and prices in the upper level were even higher.

[Blitz]

The attendance has been atrocious and if this is not a wake-up call for the organization that they are doing something wrong, then they are headed for a dark future. It is ironic that the Lions were honouring Ackles when it has become clear they have foolishly squandered all the gains made under the man's tenure (i.e., an average attendance of 35,000+ in 2008). That's no way to honour the man's legacy.

Just think how the attendance would look if we didn't have a championship caliber team.

When Wally doesn't want to open the roof on a summer night...he is thinking more like a coach than a general manager.

Bobby Ackles was really focused on marketing as well as improving the product on the field. Certainly it would help if our local media was not so Canuck focused but that is unlikely to change.

However Wally and Company really need to do more to get fans in the seats. Yes, summer is a tougher sell in Vancouver and attendance improves as the season goes on but we didn;t sell out for the WDF last season and we did't come close to having the attendance we should have for the season opener, with most expecting Geroy Simon to break the record.

You have to spend money to market a team, you have to spend that money effectivly as well, and you have to get sponsors who want to be associated...and we should be doing a better job of that because sponsors like to be associated with a winner and we have a winner right now. Ackles got sponsors on board when the product was in question. We have an outstanding product, a Grey Cup winner that is expected to challenge again, the play on the field is exciting to watch, and we are not getting bums in the seats that should correspond with the quality of the product on the field.

This is an exciting team but we need to better market some of our Leos players....and make them household names. Players like Andrew Harris, Travis Lulay, Korey Banks, Khalif Mitchell, Arland Bruce should be featured..they are colourful, talented players that everyone should be hearing about and its not just up to the media to do that..its up to our Leos organization.

I see it as complancy in terms of marketing our Leos. We also should be packaging the football game with better entertainment to bring people into the stadium. Every game should have a special feature or theme.

Its disappointing to say the least.

[MikeAK]

I think I agree with BCFan. When I was watching on TV, it certainly looked like the empty seats are in the end-zones and the corners instead of behind the benches. If ticket prices were the problem shouldn't the expensive mid-field seats be a little emptier, and shouldn't the cheaper end-zone and corner seats be more full?

I saw plenty of empty coaches sideline seats. But yes there were a lot of endzone and corner seats empty which proves my point that ticket prices and section pricing is out too lunch and HD is now a legitimate rival for the CFL. It is the high prices of the non-premium tickets that are really killing the attendance because those are where the true avg/casual fan sit. When faced with those ridiculous prices, that avg/casual fan would rather walk into a pub or watch the game in HD at home then pay it.

I see a lot of reasonable explanations from a lot of good people here but I personally am just not buying it. We have to think deeper then just locally. Today's ticket prices have completely eliminated traveling fans from outside the district. Me and my Fiance were regulars not too long ago meaning we were there almost every home game for years. We would head over on the ferry, grab a hotel room and have the best time ever at a Lion's game. It just isn't going to happen today when today's prices of the seats we want to sit in are that of what they used to cost with a hotel room not too long ago. Inflation is to be expected but the Lion's ticket prices have jump to the extreme. I imagine the Leo's have lost a great deal of fan attendance from the Island. Who knows how many from the outer districts on the mainland. Some have accused me of being extreme a few times with respects to my views on this but I see it as a serious issue when nobody is going outside of season ticket holders. That is no way to build upon a fan base. Like I've said before, current prices and an HD alternative are going to be major factors moving forward. I don't expect a drastic change come fall.

[WestCoastJoe]

Well it seems the big 4 of major league North American sports still have the attention of the sporting public: marketing, hype, clothing, etc. MLB, NFL, NBA and NFL. The CFL has the 8 teams, in Canadian cities, with television showing sports from around the world all day long. Wimbledon and the Tour de France this week. Euro last week. It is a tough market.

For the time being I think we have to live with a lot of 25,000 crowds attending CFL games.

As Yogi Berra said when he was coaching the Mets: "If they don't wanna come, how ya gonna stop 'em?" Do the marketing. Do all you can, but realize also it is an uphill battle.

I would say that the product on the field is truly exceptional. That is the key. Just look at the 3 games so far this weekend. All outstanding. And that is the nature of the CFL game. It has excitement in its DNA.

Game in and game out I find it superior to the NFL. The NFL has some good games too, but not consistently. And the NFL has the conservative bias that kills excitement. I personally have grown tired of the NBA. MLB is mostly boring until playoff time. The NHL is crash and bang. Even European soccer looks more attractive to me these days than the big four of NA sports.

I am personally optimistic about the future of the CFL. As long as the game retains that flavour, as long as we have solid ownership, as long as we have good TV coverage, which IMO we do have, the league will prosper and grow. It seems to me that it is as healthy as it has been in years.

It is a bit of niche sport, with potential to grow. Prior to the TV explosion of the big four NA major league sports, the CFL had a much stronger hold on the Canadian sports fan. That changed with television, and it will take a while longer yet to get the attention of the public back. IMO ...

[Blitz]

Well it seems the big 4 of major league North American sports still have the attention of the sporting public: marketing, hype, clothing, etc. MLB, NFL, NBA and NFL. The CFL has the 8 teams, in Canadian cities, with television showing sports from around the world all day long. Wimbledon and the Tour de France this week. Euro last week. It is a tough market.

For the time being I think we have to live with a lot of 25,000 crowds attending CFL games.

As Yogi Berra said when he was coaching the Mets: "If they don't wanna come, how ya gonna stop 'em?" Do the marketing. Do all you can, but realize also it is an uphill battle.

I would say that the product on the field is truly exceptional. That is the key. Just look at the 3 games so far this weekend. All outstanding. And that is the nature of the CFL game. It has excitement in its DNA.

Game in and game out I find it superior to the NFL. The NFL has some good games too, but not consistently. And the NFL has the conservative bias that kills excitement. I personally have grown tired of the NBA. MLB is mostly boring until playoff time. The NHL is crash and bang. Even European soccer looks more attractive to me these days than the big four of NA sports.

I am personally optimistic about the future of the CFL. As long as the game retains that flavour, as long as we have solid ownership, as long as we have good TV coverage, which IMO we do have, the league will prosper and grow. It seems to me that it is as healthy as it has been in years.

It is a bit of niche sport, with potential to grow. Prior to the TV explosion of the big four NA major league sports, the CFL had a much stronger hold on the Canadian sports fan. That changed with television, and it will take a while longer yet to get the attention of the public back. IMO ...

A lot of insightful points WCJ.

I love the CFL game. You only had to look at all the exciting plays last night in our Leos game against Hamilton or the game today with Toronto beating Calgary in the last minute. The CFL is a really exciting game. I find the NFL game boring in comparison but they sure know how to hype it down south and I wish we did a better job in that area .

Oh and by the way...an aside......your comments regarding Ricky Ray always giving his team a chance to win certainly proved to be true today as Ray led his offence to a last second winning field goal. Perhaps we should try to trade a first round draft choice, one of our two kickers and Mike Reilley to bring him to B.C, in the future Just kidding. Enjoyed the discussion we had even though we saw things differently.

The CFL is healthier than its been for years as you noted...and I think it will be even better with expansion to Ottawa in the future. I really would love to see a team in Atlantic Canada one day and have the game truly played from coast to coast.

I

[WestCoastJoe]

A lot of insightful points WCJ.

I love the CFL game. You only had to look at all the exciting plays last night in our Leos game against Hamilton or the game today with Toronto beating Calgary in the last minute. The CFL is a really exciting game. I find the NFL game boring in comparison but they sure know how to hype it down south and I wish we did a better job in that area .

Oh and by the way...an aside......your comments regarding Ricky Ray always giving his team a chance to win certainly proved to be true today as Ray led his offence to a last second winning field goal. Perhaps we should try to trade a first round draft choice, one of our two kickers and Mike Reilley to bring him to B.C, in the future Just kidding. Enjoyed the discussion we had even though we saw things differently.

The CFL is healthier than its been for years as you noted...and I think it will be even better with expansion to Ottawa in the future. I really would love to see a team in Atlantic Canada one day and have the game truly played from coast to coast.
I

LOL

I like the QBs we have right now. No trades.

My comments about Ricky Ray are about a respected opponent, one who has beaten my home town team a number of times in the past. Ricky did his thing today. Anthony and Henry did their thing yesterday. No suprise for me with Ricky. Bit of a surprise that Anthony still has it. Bit of a surprise that Henry showed so well.

Yeah we can see it differently. It would be very, very boring if we all saw everything the same way.

The CFL is healthier than its been for years as you noted...and I think it will be even better with expansion to Ottawa in the future. I really would love to see a team in Atlantic Canada one day and have the game truly played from coast to coast.

It seems that it will happen, and that would be cool. Not sure if the stadium issue will be settled for a while though. And which city? Halifax, Moncton?

[Toppy Vann]

The prices definitely are an issue in this current economy.

Theismann said that Toronto needs to win but he had also said in the TSN broadcast how when he was in Toronto that all the players lived there incl. imports and were well known in the city. I am old enough to know the days when the Lions were known here and were visible in the city as a lot lived downtown and on the North Shore. Fans identified with the players and that was a key point that Joe T made today. Today there is a lot of competition though.

[pennw]

I don't buy the price argument. My $26 season ticket ($31.50 with taxes and fees) is right by the field and parking prices just outside the stadium have come down slightly to $20 or $25, which is better than at Empire and with more transit options. A seaon's ticket is a bargain compared to other entertainment options.

It's early but attendance in the first seven games of 2012 is stable throughout the league at an average of 26,252 (compared to 26,374 in 2011), while Lions attendance through two games is up an average of nearly 4,000 to 27,230 (compared to 26,374 in 2011). The move to Empire cut into the fan base. It is starting to come back, judging by B.C. Place attendance at the end of 2011 and the start of 2012. I don't expect to see regular season crowds of 40,000 but an average of 30,000 to 35,000 is quite feasible and probabkly quite profitable.

Just checked ticketmaster and it's $146 for two tickets on the goal line , section 236 , not very good seats IMO . Would like to get better seats than that really . Same price carries all the way up to the rafters in a given section .Something wrong with that . For an out-of-towner to come in to see a game plus stay one night probably will end up being $600 night out with all the gouging that takes place every where you go in Vancouver . Hardly any wonder people just don't want to head into the city anymore .

[Bobbyp]

I was at the game last night with my 2 nephews we came in from Kelowna and went back after the game. We sat in section 217 and I have to agree its getting pricey to go to games we went to Empire for a game last year as well. I was going to buy a pop from the machines in the concession area but at 4.50 per that was ridiculous, so we waited till after the game and went to Safeway in New West where the car was parked and bought one for 2 which is still too much but less than half. Pretty entertaining game not too sure on the 563 million reno I liked Empire actually for 20 million too bad there was no skytrain there. I understand why they are charging what they do the same 25 000 will pay 100 for a ticket or 50 a ticket. But for the out of towners its pricey. I also would never buy a nhl ticket it would be more fun to flush it in the toilet. Why dont they block the top half of the stadium off.

[B.C.FAN]

Just checked ticketmaster and it's $146 for two tickets on the goal line , section 236 , not very good seats IMO . Would like to get better seats than that really . Same price carries all the way up to the rafters in a given section .Something wrong with that . For an out-of-towner to come in to see a game plus stay one night probably will end up being $600 night out with all the gouging that takes place every where you go in Vancouver . Hardly any wonder people just don't want to head into the city anymore .

If price is an issue, select a cheaper ticket category. I just found two tickets to the Edmonton game on Ticketmaster in the front row of Section 252 (in Geroy's touchdown corner) for $86, including HST and fees. They're great seats for atmosphere and fan experience if you don't mind looking at the small side of the scoreboard. You can probably get even better prices from season ticketholders or scalpers.