Yikes! Lions 2024 potential free agents

[Hambone]

I expect the Lions to prioritize re-signing their own free agents. I can’t see them spending on proven starters from other teams, especially at receiver and running back. The fact they wouldn’t spend $130,000 to retain James Butler last year shows that they’re not interested in landing a proven starter. The biggest question mark in free agency is the status of Keon Hatcher, who had Achilles surgery last month and will likely miss some or all of the 2024 season. I hope they can retain his rights but I don’t expect anyone to pay top dollar for a player with an uncertain future.

Agreed. They will deal with retaining their own priority FAs first. Then they will assess their remaining needs, who is available and what it might cost. If there's a salary fit then giddyup. It's possible a Stanback or Carey can be had on the cheap if Montreal and Calgary choose to move on. Toronto and Ottawa will be making Ouellette and Williams priorities and pay them more than BC can afford. Otherwise they are more likely to look at the likes of Morrow or Hickson out of Saskatchewan or hope to do better scouting a new tailback.

[SammyGreene]

“Priority number one is to sign our own free agents, which we’ve been already working on that. It’s kind of a fluid situation. It’s only mid-December and there’s a lot of things at play as far as either guys going to free agency or the NFL window or all those things, but we’ll continue to try to retain as many players as we can.”

An interesting comment from Campbell earlier this week in a 3 Down Nation article.
https://3downnation.com/2023/12/13/rick ... e_vignette

Entering the final week before Christmas and it's been a very quiet December on the re-signing front, especially compared to the Als that even had the money to extend Tyson Philpot with a year left on his rookie deal. Lions must have very little 2023 cap money remaining.
Last year they used the December window to extend Whyte, Menard and Pierson.

Campbell/McElvoy's biggest challenge is arguably their top 3 nationals being pending FAs and many teams would love to have them. One (Hladik) is due for a big raise coming off his rookie contract and the other two (Betts, Cottoy) had career years and also are due for a bump in pay.

Even walking away from Whitehead's contract and a potential new Hatcher deal being on IR they are still going to have to find more cap money elsewhere. And what cap saving national players still on their rookie deals are ready for full-time starter roles in 2024? Adrian Greene? Ryder Varga?

Can the Lions not afford to re-sign Hollins if Whitehead is gone and Hatcher isn't back until midway thru the 2024 season?

Is there any cap space to give Flintoff and Terry Williams a bump in pay? Williams also just finished his entry level contract.

It's shaping up to be an interesting January, leading up to FA.

[Hambone]

Entering the final week before Christmas and it's been a very quiet December on the re-signing front, especially compared to the Als that even had the money to extend Tyson Philpot with a year left on his rookie deal. Lions must have very little 2023 cap money remaining.
Last year they used the December window to extend Whyte, Menard and Pierson.

We aren't much off last year's pace. Going into Dec 16 last year 25 of 246 pending FAs had been extended leagye-wide. Hitting Dec 16 this year 21 of 268 pending FAs have been extended.

Last year BC had extended Whyte and Menard prior to the 16th while Breaux and Burnham had retired. They took care of Pierson on the 19th. This year it's only been Rouyer. Net effect BC still had 20 pending FAs to deal with at this point last offseason and have 21 pending FAs as of today. Last year after extending Pierson on Dec 19 it would be another month before they extended their 4th pending FA, David Mackie on Jan 18. In the end they extended 12 of their original list of 25 with 2 retiring. They would go on to add 7 in free agency while losing 6.

[Toppy Vann]

I think quiet in announcing deals taking potential FAs off the market early is not necessarily a sign that there's cap money issues holding the Lions back.

The agents no doubt tell these players that are wanted by others to keep quiet and use the leverage of potential Free Agency to their advantage in bargaining.
Most of these guys will say things like 'I'd like to be back here...' and the bolder ones might add a bit of the 'show me the money' thinking.

The teams no doubt are testing where the players are at - and BC has to be testing where Betts is at as with the others.

GMs like Rick Campbell know these guys and where their heads are at in nailing down their contracts and which ones are fine with the longer waiting periods.
I'm sure they know which ones don't worry about roots where they're playing at and just want to maximize the money and which prefer the certainty that comes with staying put for less money or like being closer to family on the coast here. It's those who'd part ways with you for the money that teams like the Lions might not want to pay more for. Not sure why they didn't pay James Butler.

I would sure like to know if Betts is more attracted to his home town and Als money as he's a keeper. Then, maybe money comes in. Some GMs simply won't overpay one guy as they don't want to upset their locker rooms by violating the Sam Pollack dictum when he was GM of the high flying Montreal Canadiens. IIRC he believed that you pay your players as if your accounts book was stolen tomorrow and players find out exactly what you're paying. In these days, there's more openness but the principle is not gone. Bombers whine that this hurts them as they have more money than many teams but the money management system hurts them. The contrary view is that it could mean they are a dynasty that way.


Things like the Als extending Tyson Philpot no doubt reflects the value he gave them this year and their belief in his growing potential to do even more. Nailing that down when he's still celebrating is good timing lol. He is not just a good Receiver but can run back kicks if they need that giving him an extra advantage as he's a Canadian kid who has really grown as a player. I watched him and his brother taking passes from Michael O'Connor during Covid just hoping they'd have CFL careers. Other than Jalen being injured and not playing this season, both are likely to have good careers in the CFL.

[Toppy Vann]

Detroit Lions work out award-winning B.C. Lions’ edge rusher Mathieu Betts
By 3Down Staff -December 20, 2023

Might be just keeping busy and learning or he might have a desire for bigger and better in the NFL.

https://3downnation.com/2023/12/20/detr ... ieu-betts/

Sammy Greene post:

Betts achieved all his bonus payouts in 2023 to end up making $206,000. That contract in 2022 was based on his potential and did he ever live up to it but what is his value now and can the Lions afford him if he hits the open market? Riders' Anthony Lanier is the league's highest paid defensive player at $250,000. Can't see the league's sack leader and a ratio breaker to boot asking for anything less.

His size for the NFL at 250 lbs seems small for where he plays most effectively but you can't blame a guy for trying.

But he'd be big enough for the Als come February if he can't be signed.
Have to wait and hope BC can retain him.

[Hambone]

Detroit Lions work out award-winning B.C. Lions’ edge rusher Mathieu Betts
By 3Down Staff -December 20, 2023

Might be just keeping busy and learning or he might have a desire for bigger and better in the NFL.

https://3downnation.com/2023/12/20/detr ... ieu-betts/

Sammy Greene post:

Betts achieved all his bonus payouts in 2023 to end up making $206,000. That contract in 2022 was based on his potential and did he ever live up to it but what is his value now and can the Lions afford him if he hits the open market? Riders' Anthony Lanier is the league's highest paid defensive player at $250,000. Can't see the league's sack leader and a ratio breaker to boot asking for anything less.

His size for the NFL at 250 lbs seems small for where he plays most effectively but you can't blame a guy for trying.

But he'd be big enough for the Als come February if he can't be signed.
Have to wait and hope BC can retain him.

These guys are all ultra competitive and driven to compete at the highest level possible. Coming off the season he had it's only natural for Betts to wonder if he can compete at the next level. Given his age and pending FA status this is his last chance to try. Whether anything comes out of this or any other workouts remains to be seen. But at least he can come out of the excercise knowing he gave it a shot as opposed to retiring wondering "what if".

[SammyGreene]

Detroit Lions work out award-winning B.C. Lions’ edge rusher Mathieu Betts
By 3Down Staff -December 20, 2023

Might be just keeping busy and learning or he might have a desire for bigger and better in the NFL.

https://3downnation.com/2023/12/20/detr ... ieu-betts/

Sammy Greene post:

Betts achieved all his bonus payouts in 2023 to end up making $206,000. That contract in 2022 was based on his potential and did he ever live up to it but what is his value now and can the Lions afford him if he hits the open market? Riders' Anthony Lanier is the league's highest paid defensive player at $250,000. Can't see the league's sack leader and a ratio breaker to boot asking for anything less.

His size for the NFL at 250 lbs seems small for where he plays most effectively but you can't blame a guy for trying.

But he'd be big enough for the Als come February if he can't be signed.
Have to wait and hope BC can retain him.

These guys are all ultra competitive and driven to compete at the highest level possible. Coming off the season he had it's only natural for Betts to wonder if he can compete at the next level. Given his age and pending FA status this is his last chance to try. Whether anything comes out of this or any other workouts remains to be seen. But at least he can come out of the excercise knowing he gave it a shot as opposed to retiring wondering "what if".

I think his last NFL tryout was just prior to signing with BC so hopefully Betts is on the same path right back here again. JC Abbott was critical of Betts' run stopping ability to the point where he selected Gary Peters over him as BC's nominee for top defensive player.
He has a terrific motor and obviously heads south this time with a much more impressive resume . Maybe he gets some consideration as a pass rush specialist to at least earn a training camp invite.

Wonder if we will soon be hearing of FAs Hollins (27) or Woods (25) getting NFL tryouts too.

[OV:54-40]

Abbott often doesn't know what he's talking about; Betts was amongst tackle leaders for CFL D-linemen, and yep has a great motor and often tracks down ball carriers from behind; if Betts had a resume from a big Div I program, Abbott would be way more approving.

Don't recall Betts having another NFL try-out other than the one with the Bears before he came into the CFL ?

And 250 is hardly too light for an NFL rush end.

I doubt he gets anymore than a cursory NFL look, but good luck to him.

Wonder if the Als would make a big push to sign him? - I doubt they will offer big CFL buck$ though.

[Hambone]

Abbott often doesn't know what he's talking about; Betts was amongst tackle leaders for CFL D-linemen, and yep has a great motor and often tracks down ball carriers from behind; if Betts had a resume from a big Div I program, Abbott would be way more approving.

Don't recall Betts having another NFL try-out other than the one with the Bears before he came into the CFL ?

Want to provide some context re: Abbott so we know what you're talking about? His opinions are generally thoughtful, measured and quite well respected in these parts.

Betts had more than a tryout with the Bears. He'd already signed with them as a UDFA and was under contract when Edmonton drafted him. He wouldn't sign with Edmonton until September after being released amongst Chicago's final cuts.

Betts had a workout with Jacksonville just this past January.

https://3downnation.com/2023/01/05/b-c- ... e-jaguars/

[Hambone]

Add Cleveland to Betts' workout list.

https://3downnation.com/2023/12/22/clev ... ieu-betts/

[OV:54-40]

Abbott often doesn't know what he's talking about; Betts was amongst tackle leaders for CFL D-linemen, and yep has a great motor and often tracks down ball carriers from behind; if Betts had a resume from a big Div I program, Abbott would be way more approving.

Don't recall Betts having another NFL try-out other than the one with the Bears before he came into the CFL ?

Want to provide some context re: Abbott so we know what you're talking about? His opinions are generally thoughtful, measured and quite well respected in these parts.

Betts had more than a tryout with the Bears. He'd already signed with them as a UDFA and was under contract when Edmonton drafted him. He wouldn't sign with Edmonton until September after being released amongst Chicago's final cuts.

Betts had a workout with Jacksonville just this past January.

https://3downnation.com/2023/01/05/b-c- ... e-jaguars/

I appreciate & follow Abbott's efforts to track Canadian players who might become CFL (or NFL for that matter) prospects; and he has good knowledge of Canadians getting to play US college ball; he has also been quite dismissive of top U Sports talent when talking CFL potential; - the Betts slight is one example of many. Maybe him and a few other CFL standard party line parrotts should start noticing / respecting the talent of top U Sports talent - a bit more anyways - like Betts, DeQuoy, Tre Ford, KSB, Antwi, Hladik, Philpot, Auclair - until after it stares them in the face in the CFL.

Didn't recall that Betts' trip to Jacksonville last year, even though I likely read it on 3 Down. The Mickey Mouse one day NFL try-out is one thing that a whole bunch of football players can garner nowdays; a real try-out is IMO full TC and playing time in ex. games.

[Hambone]

I appreciate & follow Abbott's efforts to track Canadian players who might become CFL (or NFL for that matter) prospects; and he has good knowledge of Canadians getting to play US college ball; he has also been quite dismissive of top U Sports talent when talking CFL potential; - the Betts slight is one example of many. Maybe him and a few other CFL standard party line parrotts should start noticing / respecting the talent of top U Sports talent - a bit more anyways - like Betts, DeQuoy, Tre Ford, KSB, Antwi, Hladik, Philpot, Auclair - until after it stares them in the face in the CFL.

Didn't recall that Betts' trip to Jacksonville last year, even though I likely read it on 3 Down. The Mickey Mouse one day NFL try-out is one thing that a whole bunch of football players can garner nowdays; a real try-out is IMO full TC and playing time in ex. games.

I still don't know where this Abbott Betts slight comes from or the context. At least provide a link so I can understand where you're coming from.

There was a good article I read earlier today where Chris Streveler talked about the workouts and that CFLers shouldn't make the NFL out to bigger in their minds than it really is before they go down those paths. Those workouts he says, and he's had a ton of them, often last as much as an hour. If only my sometimers would let me remember where I saw it to provide the link. It was a decent read.

[Hambone]

Wonder if we will soon be hearing of FAs Hollins (27) or Woods (25) getting NFL tryouts too.

Here's your answer on Woods. Worked out by Denver.

https://3downnation.com/2023/12/22/denv ... ijgku6sbjo

[OV:54-40]

I appreciate & follow Abbott's efforts to track Canadian players who might become CFL (or NFL for that matter) prospects; and he has good knowledge of Canadians getting to play US college ball; he has also been quite dismissive of top U Sports talent when talking CFL potential; - the Betts slight is one example of many. Maybe him and a few other CFL standard party line parrotts should start noticing / respecting the talent of top U Sports talent - a bit more anyways - like Betts, DeQuoy, Tre Ford, KSB, Antwi, Hladik, Philpot, Auclair - until after it stares them in the face in the CFL.

Didn't recall that Betts' trip to Jacksonville last year, even though I likely read it on 3 Down. The Mickey Mouse one day NFL try-out is one thing that a whole bunch of football players can garner nowdays; a real try-out is IMO full TC and playing time in ex. games.

I still don't know where this Abbott Betts slight comes from or the context. At least provide a link so I can understand where you're coming from.

There was a good article I read earlier today where Chris Streveler talked about the workouts and that CFLers shouldn't make the NFL out to bigger in their minds than it really is before they go down those paths. Those workouts he says, and he's had a ton of them, often last as much as an hour. If only my sometimers would let me remember where I saw it to provide the link. It was a decent read.

Sorry, don't know how to do the links thing or which specific article to look for - it was on a 3 Down piece where Abbott suggested Betts wasn't very good against the run (dead wrong) and said he voted for another Lion (maybe Peters ?) for their top D player nominee (and fair enough - he's a very good one too).

Again, if Betts had a resume from a big Div I program, I'd bet JC's attitude towards him would be quite different.

The NFL has so much money and time to look at all sorts of football prospects for their ever larger rosters; and can't blame a guy who isn't there for jumping at a one hour so-called "try-out" if that's all he could get, That the NFL scouts are too lazy, myopic or dumb to look at hours of CFL game film in terms of evaluating top CFL players, and defer to one hour "work-outs" instead, is mind boggling to me. But I'm sure Tommy (not Danny) DeVito would have just dominated the CFL at QB like Rourke did if Tommy Cutlets had got the chance.

[B.C.FAN]

There was a good article I read earlier today where Chris Streveler talked about the workouts and that CFLers shouldn't make the NFL out to bigger in their minds than it really is before they go down those paths. Those workouts he says, and he's had a ton of them, often last as much as an hour. If only my sometimers would let me remember where I saw it to provide the link. It was a decent read.

The Chris Streveler article was in the Winnipeg Sun.

https://winnipegsun.com/sports/football ... than-it-is