petition TSN to change all-time Lions team

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cms22
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petition TSN to change all-time Lions team

i was thinking we should petition TSN to change the all-time Lions team.

there are 2 big omissions, although one is a little fuzzy

1) Korey Banks - 7-time all-west for Lions. Seven straight seasons....... the all-time Lions secondary has 1-time all-west and some of Banks teammates..... i have a hard time thinking theyhad Banks as a strong candidate and cut him at the very end. i think they overlooked him. i'd think they'd at least mention the omission if it was deliberate.......... there is very slight issue of which all-west teams were based on 4 vs. 5 western teams, but it's slight. and my brain is hurting thinking of which years were which...

another guess is they went with analytics to get the candidates. but then when they realized "too many players from X team in the secondary" they just made the deletion based on gut-feel. also, maybe positions in secondary, but i don't think most people know them or if they matter that much (they matter more in NFL it seems due to 1) more defending run, 2) more defending tall wr and tight ends

2) Bobby Ackles - definitely think he should be there for inspirational leader........ of course, that list mostly players and is very discretionary, so i can see them missing Ackles, especially if this was done by TSN researchers/CFL personalities (at TSN) vs. some vancouver representation.

no idea how we would do this...... i might just email 3down website to start........ this might get the lions some good free local publicity............larscheid is worthy of being on list, but i don't think broadcasters are eligible
Last edited by cms22 on Thu Aug 27, 2020 10:55 am, edited 1 time in total.


cms22
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Re: petition TSN to change all-time Lions team

on Korey Banks, i worry somehow that my facts are wrong........ but i've checked/re-checked many times.


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Re: petition TSN to change all-time Lions team

cms22 wrote:
Thu Aug 27, 2020 10:51 am
on Korey Banks, i worry somehow that my facts are wrong........ but i've checked/re-checked many times.
On January 31, 2014, Banks was traded to the Winnipeg Blue Bombers in exchange for non-import wide receiver Kito Poblah.[4] On February 19, 2014, the Bombers signed Banks to a contract extension through the 2015 CFL season.[5] Banks was reportedly a healthy scratch for the Bombers' first game of the season and was eventually released on June 29, 2014 when he could not be traded.[6]

Many Bomber fans gave up waiting for an explanation for that one.

If you want one from the sinister conspiracies file, my theory is he clashed with Mike O'Shea over philosphy or strategy and he learned whose side the boss was on.

Wade Miller enjoys burying people and it wouldn't surprise me in the least if he had a part in Banks not being recognized. He did get a good signing bonus and no doubt he would have been our best player on that woeful team but that's not how the Bombers operate. Adam bighill spilled the beans with the FIFO (fit in or .... off) sign that hangs over the dressing room door. Pretty sure O'Shea brought the sign with him from Toronto.


cms22
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Re: petition TSN to change all-time Lions team

i lived in winnipeg for a number of years....... don't want to comment publicly on this forum, but mentioning WM's name in winnipeg certainly generated some interesting responses.

LOVED his father Al, the former bomber and redskins linebacker. the king of my condo hot-tub :)

on lion's who made all-west, all of AW/KB/JO were 7 consecutive selections...... LP had tons of selections, but punter and kicker and category for kicker/punter didn't exist every year. for the record, he was 9 selections. he played so long of course.


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Re: petition TSN to change all-time Lions team

I was thinking about this idea a little bit and though I think that there are many people deserving of a place on an all-time team, it becomes a somewhat self-defeating thing because there are only so many position and adding names generally would mean taking off names. Anybody remember the Red Robinson Theatre in Coquitlam which was changed? Now it is named after a beer. Real nice way to treat a person by throwing their name out in favour of a can of suds. I thought that was and is incredibly disrespectful to Red. Changing the all-time team kind of feels like it in that vein. Who gets taken off? I think I would rather just leave that as it is and perhaps start a new list of Lions greats and call them the Lions Honour Guard or something along that vein. Name players and other who made outstanding contributions to the team to that and let them remain there for all time. New names can be added as time progresses, their are no limits to who can be added and it nicely avoids the inevitable arguments about who was better at this position and how come so and so didn't make the team etc. etc.


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Re: petition TSN to change all-time Lions team

Murdoch wrote:
Thu Aug 27, 2020 12:51 pm
cms22 wrote:
Thu Aug 27, 2020 10:51 am
on Korey Banks, i worry somehow that my facts are wrong........ but i've checked/re-checked many times.
On January 31, 2014, Banks was traded to the Winnipeg Blue Bombers in exchange for non-import wide receiver Kito Poblah.[4] On February 19, 2014, the Bombers signed Banks to a contract extension through the 2015 CFL season.[5] Banks was reportedly a healthy scratch for the Bombers' first game of the season and was eventually released on June 29, 2014 when he could not be traded.[6]

Many Bomber fans gave up waiting for an explanation for that one.

If you want one from the sinister conspiracies file, my theory is he clashed with Mike O'Shea over philosphy or strategy and he learned whose side the boss was on.

Wade Miller enjoys burying people and it wouldn't surprise me in the least if he had a part in Banks not being recognized. He did get a good signing bonus and no doubt he would have been our best player on that woeful team but that's not how the Bombers operate. Adam bighill spilled the beans with the FIFO (fit in or .... off) sign that hangs over the dressing room door. Pretty sure O'Shea brought the sign with him from Toronto.
Maybe in Winnipeg the Bombers came to realize the same thing Buono recognized in BC? What led to Banks' departure in BC was that as he had done every previous year he wanted to re-do his contract to be paid money up front. Wally was OK with that as he recognized Banks was virtually a lock to make the team. Come 2014 with Banks heading for his 35th birthday Wally was no longer convinced he was a lock and balked at paying money in advance for a player who might not make the team. As we all know Banks, who was never shy about venting his spleen, protested and started publicly pouting which led to the trade to Winnipeg.

I suspect in Winnipeg when he didn't suit up for the season opener his mouth greased his own skids. Perhaps it played a role in him being scratched for that season opener in the first place? Keep in mind that was also O'Shea's rookie season as an HC. It's absolutely crucial for a rookie HC to assert himself as being in charge. The combination of that need plus Banks' willingness to spout off was likely fatal for his tenure in Winnipeg. If Banks started beaking off trying to assert himself as the alpha dog in the locker room O'Shea would have to do something to ensure everybody knew it was him running the asylum, not the inmates. Certainly there's no lack of history with coaches, rookies or new to a team, in all sports asserting themselves by making a seemingly controversial decision on a veteran. Banks by way of his mouth may have built too good a case for him to be that veteran O'Shea need to make an example of.


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Re: petition TSN to change all-time Lions team

Hambone wrote:
Fri Aug 28, 2020 8:38 am
Maybe in Winnipeg the Bombers came to realize the same thing Buono recognized in BC? What led to Banks' departure in BC was that as he had done every previous year he wanted to re-do his contract to be paid money up front. Wally was OK with that as he recognized Banks was virtually a lock to make the team. Come 2014 with Banks heading for his 35th birthday Wally was no longer convinced he was a lock and balked at paying money in advance for a player who might not make the team. As we all know Banks, who was never shy about venting his spleen, protested and started publicly pouting which led to the trade to Winnipeg.

I suspect in Winnipeg when he didn't suit up for the season opener his mouth greased his own skids. Perhaps it played a role in him being scratched for that season opener in the first place? Keep in mind that was also O'Shea's rookie season as an HC. It's absolutely crucial for a rookie HC to assert himself as being in charge. The combination of that need plus Banks' willingness to spout off was likely fatal for his tenure in Winnipeg. If Banks started beaking off trying to assert himself as the alpha dog in the locker room O'Shea would have to do something to ensure everybody knew it was him running the asylum, not the inmates. Certainly there's no lack of history with coaches, rookies or new to a team, in all sports asserting themselves by making a seemingly controversial decision on a veteran. Banks by way of his mouth may have built too good a case for him to be that veteran O'Shea need to make an example of.
Agreed. Banks, Marsh and Phillips all had lengthy careers as CFL all-stars but they wanted to keep playing beyond their best-before date. In all cases, Wally knew when their time was up.


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Murdoch
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Re: petition TSN to change all-time Lions team

Hambone wrote:
Fri Aug 28, 2020 8:38 am
Maybe in Winnipeg the Bombers came to realize the same thing Buono recognized in BC? What led to Banks' departure in BC was that as he had done every previous year he wanted to re-do his contract to be paid money up front. Wally was OK with that as he recognized Banks was virtually a lock to make the team. Come 2014 with Banks heading for his 35th birthday Wally was no longer convinced he was a lock and balked at paying money in advance for a player who might not make the team. As we all know Banks, who was never shy about venting his spleen, protested and started publicly pouting which led to the trade to Winnipeg.

I suspect in Winnipeg when he didn't suit up for the season opener his mouth greased his own skids. Perhaps it played a role in him being scratched for that season opener in the first place? Keep in mind that was also O'Shea's rookie season as an HC. It's absolutely crucial for a rookie HC to assert himself as being in charge. The combination of that need plus Banks' willingness to spout off was likely fatal for his tenure in Winnipeg. If Banks started beaking off trying to assert himself as the alpha dog in the locker room O'Shea would have to do something to ensure everybody knew it was him running the asylum, not the inmates. Certainly there's no lack of history with coaches, rookies or new to a team, in all sports asserting themselves by making a seemingly controversial decision on a veteran. Banks by way of his mouth may have built too good a case for him to be that veteran O'Shea need to make an example of.
Probably as close to the truth as we'll ever know. Sad part the fan is the one who loses.

Winning teams have winning players and some come with "baggage". Tough to be a player that consistently performs at a high level on the field but can't do anything right off of it. There have been many. DC as notable as any. Charles Roberts got the same "i'll show you who the boss is" from Doug Berry.

Rick Campbell tossed half a dozen guys in Ottawa. Purifoy and AC Leonard being two.

It's no secret that Mike O'Shea rewards loyalty. Hard to get excited though about the Bombers signing 32 year old Julian Feoli Guidino. Not that he is not a good player.


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Hambone
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Re: petition TSN to change all-time Lions team

Bottom line these sorts of lists are intended to generate discussion. You can be guaranteed none of fan bases of the 9 teams would proclaim TSN nailed it on their club. Every fan base will be talking about players they felt deserved to be on the list and those who they think didn't deserve to be.


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Re: petition TSN to change all-time Lions team

B.C.FAN wrote:
Fri Aug 28, 2020 12:22 pm
Agreed. Banks, Marsh and Phillips all had lengthy careers as CFL all-stars but they wanted to keep playing beyond their best-before date. In all cases, Wally knew when their time was up.
Elite players don't get where they are by being unsure of themselves. There's always a degree of ego involved. All three of the aforementioned DBs wanted to keep the band together but Wally was singing a different tune.

Unfortunately, only one of the three (Ryan Phillips) seems to have forgiven and forgotten and made his way back to the Den. I get the sense that Marsh and Banks don't get the warm and fuzzies when their former employer's name comes up. Due to that healthy ego, they don't seem willing to forget. Sad.

That being said, Banks has every right to be peeved at being left off the list.


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Re: petition TSN to change all-time Lions team

Unfortunately the concept of "keeping the bad together" just doesn't fly in today's salary cap world regardless of sport. For solid vets the likes of the trio David mentioned salary caps likely have knocked an average of 2 years off the tail ends of many careers.


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