TSN all-time Lions team

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Robbie
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Robbie wrote:
Sat Aug 15, 2020 3:55 pm
And whenever there's such a list, it looks like seniority of the team is always a bigger factor than simply good quality and individual accolades and awards while on the team. . So other words, an above average Lion with many years with the team will be selected over a great but very short-term Lion.
Furthermore, I'd say two additional considerations for such lists would be:

1. If the player leaves the Lions other than retirement, the circumstances of his departure as to whether it was an amicable one.
2. If that player also played for another team, then whether that player was also a great contributor to the other team and might better remembered as a member of that other team.

As such, Lions would played most of their career as a Lion and preferably retired as a Lion are more likely to be added to such lists.

So that said, these players who were chosen are definitely questionable with similar circumstances in that they all bolted to Winnipeg and later did well as Blue Bombers:

1. Andrew Harris expressed his displeasure with the BC Lions after 2015 and as such, he was not re-signed so he moved on to Winnipeg where he won Most Outstanding Canadian and of course a Grey Cup with a GC MVC award.

2. To a lesser extent but similar to Andrew Harris, Barrin Simpson also left for Winnipeg after 2005 and he did fairly well as a Blue Bomber too.

3. Finally as a third example, Adam Bighill also left for Winnipeg after a stint in New Orleans after 2016, and he won Most Outstanding Defensive player as a Blue Bomber in 2018.


祝加拿大加式足球聯賽不列颠哥伦比亚卑詩雄獅隊今年贏格雷杯冠軍。此外祝溫哥華加人隊贏總統獎座·卡雲斯·甘保杯·史丹利盃。還每年祝溫哥華白頭浪隊贏美國足球大联盟杯。不要忘記每年祝溫哥華巨人贏西部冰球聯盟冠軍。
改建後的卑詩體育館於二十十一年九月三十日重新對外開放,首場體育活動為同日舉行的加拿大足球聯賽賽事,由主場的卑詩雄獅隊以三十三比二十四擊敗愛民頓愛斯基摩人隊。
祝你老鼠年行大運。
恭喜西雅图海鹰直到第四十八屆超級盃最終四十三比八大勝曾拿下兩次超級盃冠軍的丹佛野馬拿下隊史第一個超級盃冠軍。
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KnowItAll
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Less Browne would be one of my corners.

My other fav, if not best, is Andre Francis.


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DanoT
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Wally gets the call at HC, but if I wanted to win games it would be Don Mathews as HC.


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David
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Big oversight in Korey Banks. Massive playmaker, year in and year out. Very reliable and had longevity. Didn't we draft him from Ottawa when the Renegades folded? 8 great seasons!

It should never be forgotten that Jim "Dirty 30" Young did not have great quarterbacks throwing to him so would be on my All-Time list. In 1972, he reached 1,362 receiving yards in 16 games from QBs Don Moorhead and Don Bunce, probably like the 14th and 60th best all-time BC Lions quarterbacks throwing to him (All-American Bunce was a one and done QB who retired in the off-season to pursue medicine. Moorhead would be ranked that high primarily due to running ability and knack for reading defences).


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cms22
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a few thoughts,

i only see 6 national starters....... was there a condition that there be canadian starters? of course, having interior OL import starters might be hard as there have been very few.

the d-line is basically 4 defensive ends i think.......... canadian football is smaller so maybe that's ok. hebeler might have been a bit bigger... is hebeler there as canadian? or legit top 4 dlineman?........ hebeler was amazing "franchise guy" being from coquitlam.

i think there should be one canadian receiver as most teams play 2 or 3 canadian receivers... of course, this team has 2 dline canadians.

i think including both fleming/harris is wimpy. choose one or the other.


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Robbie
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KnowItAll wrote:
Sun Aug 16, 2020 11:14 pm
Less Browne would be one of my corners.
My other fav, if not best, is Andre Francis.
For me, Less Browne better remembered as a Tiger-Cat and a Blue Bomber. In the 1985 GC, in Lions favour he didn't cover Ned Armour well and as a result, Dewalt was able to throw two long TD passes to Armour.

And Andre Francis in his most important game as a Lion in the 1988 GC, he was assigned to cover James Murphy and he didn't cover him well in the first half as he allowed Murphy to make 5 catches for 165 yards and a TD.
cms22 wrote:
Thu Aug 20, 2020 2:44 pm
i only see 6 national starters....... was there a condition that there be canadian starters? of course, having interior OL import starters might be hard as there have been very few.
No, absolutely no condition about National being included in this list. Whenever there's such a list of best players, there's enough biases and adding yet another condition about having National makes such lists even more biases.


祝加拿大加式足球聯賽不列颠哥伦比亚卑詩雄獅隊今年贏格雷杯冠軍。此外祝溫哥華加人隊贏總統獎座·卡雲斯·甘保杯·史丹利盃。還每年祝溫哥華白頭浪隊贏美國足球大联盟杯。不要忘記每年祝溫哥華巨人贏西部冰球聯盟冠軍。
改建後的卑詩體育館於二十十一年九月三十日重新對外開放,首場體育活動為同日舉行的加拿大足球聯賽賽事,由主場的卑詩雄獅隊以三十三比二十四擊敗愛民頓愛斯基摩人隊。
祝你老鼠年行大運。
恭喜西雅图海鹰直到第四十八屆超級盃最終四十三比八大勝曾拿下兩次超級盃冠軍的丹佛野馬拿下隊史第一個超級盃冠軍。
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KnowItAll wrote:
Sun Aug 16, 2020 11:14 pm
Less Browne would be one of my corners.

My other fav, if not best, is Andre Francis.
Agreed on Andre Francis. I think he should have gotten in over Keith Gooch.

Would have also like to see Anthony Drawhorn in.


cms22
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as to restrictions, i think TSN's all-time teams for the canadian nhl franchises had a few restrictions

1) minimum one current player

2) needed to be one defensive forward line and shutdown defensive pairing... couldn't be all scorers.

3) not sure about this one.. but i think defensemen had to be right and left pairings. forwards is so much simpler although i can see people just putting the 3 highest point players as the first line.

4) not a restriction but i think each team had an inspirational builder type player.. who would the lions be? (and the player is not one already on the main team)........ hebeler and passaglia seem great if they weren't already on team.... can't think of the obvious person beyond those 2.

i realize this is football forum..... but i found it amazing that doug gilmour and darryl sittler didn't make the team......

as per long-term vs. short-term, i think greatness over the short-term should be recognized more. the name that comes to mind with lions is mervyn fernandez but he's already on team......

in another sport, someone like dale murphy who won back-to-back NL MVPs vs. someone who played at an above average level for 10 -15 years (craig biggio.... don mattingly) . i think the 2 years of dominance are underrated. and murphy had some other good years. but not tons of years of good play

my own personal opinion but i think a lions all-time team should reflect the canadian ratio.. and as said, you get a good start with 3 automatic inside OL players


Murdoch
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Robbie wrote:
Thu Aug 20, 2020 3:11 pm
And Andre Francis in his most important game as a Lion in the 1988 GC, he was assigned to cover James Murphy and he didn't cover him well in the first half as he allowed Murphy to make 5 catches for 165 yards and a TD.
You make it sound like covering James Murphy was an easy thing to do. 1986 CFL MOP. The only Bomber ever better was Milt.


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Robbie
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cms22 wrote:
Sat Aug 22, 2020 12:16 pm
as per long-term vs. short-term, i think greatness over the short-term should be recognized more. the name that comes to mind with lions is mervyn fernandez but he's already on team......
I created this thread in 2010 on best short-term BC Lions:
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=19125
Murdoch wrote:
Sat Aug 22, 2020 4:44 pm
You make it sound like covering James Murphy was an easy thing to do. 1986 CFL MOP. The only Bomber ever better was Milt.
Keith Gooch and the other Lions secondary did a decent job covering him in 1983, 1985, 1986, and 1987 by winning important games against the Blue Bombers. And ironically those games were mostly quarterbacked by a Hall of Famer - Tom Clements. And the Lions didn't do so well covering him in 1988 - 1990 even though they were quarterbacked by certainly non-Hall of Famers, Sean Salisbury and Tom Burgess.

While arguably Milt Stegall is better than James Murphy in terms for Blue Bombers receivers, one huge difference between the two is that Stegall never won the elusive Grey Cup in his 14-year CFL career while Murphy won three.


祝加拿大加式足球聯賽不列颠哥伦比亚卑詩雄獅隊今年贏格雷杯冠軍。此外祝溫哥華加人隊贏總統獎座·卡雲斯·甘保杯·史丹利盃。還每年祝溫哥華白頭浪隊贏美國足球大联盟杯。不要忘記每年祝溫哥華巨人贏西部冰球聯盟冠軍。
改建後的卑詩體育館於二十十一年九月三十日重新對外開放,首場體育活動為同日舉行的加拿大足球聯賽賽事,由主場的卑詩雄獅隊以三十三比二十四擊敗愛民頓愛斯基摩人隊。
祝你老鼠年行大運。
恭喜西雅图海鹰直到第四十八屆超級盃最終四十三比八大勝曾拿下兩次超級盃冠軍的丹佛野馬拿下隊史第一個超級盃冠軍。
Murdoch
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Robbie wrote:
Sat Aug 22, 2020 8:30 pm
While arguably Milt Stegall is better than James Murphy in terms for Blue Bombers receivers, one huge difference between the two is that Stegall never won the elusive Grey Cup in his 14-year CFL career while Murphy won three.
That was never on Milt.


cms22
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there are some giant time gaps (or maybe one player) in the greatest lions team.

the comment was made "winnipeg being perennial loser wasn't on milt"..... but it seems like the lions picks correlate with winning teams

having said that, i don't have a specfic player in mind.

one player from winning teams who i think was awesome was kerry parker


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B.C.FAN
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cms22 wrote:
Wed Aug 26, 2020 2:22 pm
there are some giant time gaps (or maybe one player) in the greatest lions team.

the comment was made "winnipeg being perennial loser wasn't on milt"..... but it seems like the lions picks correlate with winning teams

having said that, i don't have a specfic player in mind.

one player from winning teams who i think was awesome was kerry parker
Jim Young is one star player who played during a dark period in the team's history. The Lions had a winning record in only two of Young's 13 seasons with the team from 1967 to 1979, and no Grey Cup appearances, yet he still ranks second to Geroy Simon in all-time receiving yards.


"I think [Fred Fateri] was like a lot of people who watch football, hockey or any professional sport on television. They sit there and think they could coach better than the professional. Some people really think that." - Bob Ackles, The Water Boy
cms22
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did a deep dive on BC Lions and players that have made all-western and all-CFL teams.

THERE IS ONE GLARING OMISSION ON THE TEAM....... i would pretty much assume they forgot about him..................KOREY BANKS. he was all-western conference 7 straight years.

so Korey Banks 7 straight all-western conference pick for BC.

the 5 starters on all-time BC team

dante marsh 4x
eric carter 5x (surprised me...... i had forgotten about him)
keith gooch 1x
ryan phillips 5x
larry crawford 4x

Banks over Gooch seems obvious. maybe too many players from one era... but it seems like it should Banks over one of the other 2 or 3 from his era.

some other interesting tidbits:

Nick Hebeler, who i agree is an all-time great Lion, made 1 all-western team. (he did make all CFL that year).... the selection rules say nothing to do with canadian content. so i'd say he shouldn't be there.

andrew harris 2x all-west over sean millington 5x all-west.......... i do think AH had more effect per game on the game but i also think he played with much better players/teams

glen jackson 7x all-west lost to simpson, bighill, solly....... hard one to judge.. obviously there is 1) great recency bias to the all-time team, 2) TSN promotes the talent relentlessly these, often to the detriment of actually describing the game.

not saying they should be on team but aaron hunt deserves mention.......... and kevin konar had 2 or3 all-West and he was canadian (not a criteria....... but IRL very very important)

i thought there might be an old receiver who was deserving over manny arcenault but it appears as though there isn't.

nothing to do with all-time BC team but jerry tagge was all-CFL one year

had never heard of jim evenson who was all-west 4 times... probably dark days.

can someone give me a cliff notes on lions history?.. how many distinct great eras did they have? 3 or 4?

one lions defense had 8 of the all-west picks...... and another had 6 of the back 8 players all-west.


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B.C.FAN
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cms22 wrote:
Wed Aug 26, 2020 4:29 pm
had never heard of jim evenson who was all-west 4 times... probably dark days.

can someone give me a cliff notes on lions history?.. how many distinct great eras did they have? 3 or 4?

one lions defense had 8 of the all-west picks...... and another had 6 of the back 8 players all-west.
Jim Evenson and the legendary George Reed were the two dominant running backs in the CFL during their era. Yes, he played during the dark days of the franchise from 1968-71 but he remains second behind Willie Fleming in all-time rushing yards by a Lion. He was a CFL West all-star four times and CFL all-star twice. That same era produced Jim Young, the second all-time receiver in Lions history. They were two star players on bad teams, which makes their individual accomplishments even more significant.

https://www.cflapedia.com/Players/e/evenson_jim.htm


"I think [Fred Fateri] was like a lot of people who watch football, hockey or any professional sport on television. They sit there and think they could coach better than the professional. Some people really think that." - Bob Ackles, The Water Boy
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