why is CFL interest so tepid in toronto?

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Murdoch
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Re: why is CFL interest so tepid in toronto?

Huge Talent wrote:
Thu May 21, 2020 7:01 pm
Back to the marketing fundamentals: the 4 Ps
Curious as to the demographic of your target market? Right now it seems they are hitting on all cylinders with the male 60+ crowd. I would like to have said 50+ and hope it isn't any worse than 65.

Uncontrollable variables such as competition targeting the same market can also disrupt a good plan. Lifting local blackouts for increased television revenue started a trend that has snowballed into an issue they now have to deal with.

Can't see blackouts coming back. Teams need the television revenue and they just locked in for six more years with TSN which was kind of dumb imo. Head office needs the tv money worse than the teams.
Last edited by Murdoch on Mon May 25, 2020 12:24 pm, edited 2 times in total.


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Re: why is CFL interest so tepid in toronto?

It's not just the 3rd bye, it's all byes. I don't know which weekend will be considered "Canada Day Weekend" this year as Canada Day falls on a Wednesday. The weekend of July 4/5 likely becomes "Canada Day Weekend" as summer CFL weeks typically start with Thursday Night Football which this year would be July 2nd. In that scenario CFL Weekend 18 becomes October 31/Nov 1. 18 week schedule = no byes although with 9 teams somebody needs to have the week off.

Damned if they do, damned if they don't. Keep in mind Canada Day is one of those stats that moves around not necessarily falling on a weekend. It can also fall in the middle of the week meaning there is no real Canada Day Weekend, just a one day Canada Day. Want to make Canada Day the start of the season then you have to be prepared to eliminate byes forcing all teams to play 3 games in 9 or 10 days at some point(s) during the season or push Grey Cup out into December. The CFL who feels bye weeks are beneficial to player safety and reducing injuries wouldl never get the PA to drop the bye weeks now that they have them. For many players from both sides of the border those bye weeks are the only opportunities they have to get a few days in with their families in the 6 months from when they leave for training camp until the season is over.


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Re: why is CFL interest so tepid in toronto?

Hambone wrote:
Mon May 25, 2020 10:21 am
It's not just the 3rd bye, it's all byes. I don't know which weekend will be considered "Canada Day Weekend" this year as Canada Day falls on a Wednesday. The weekend of July 4/5 likely becomes "Canada Day Weekend" as summer CFL weeks typically start with Thursday Night Football which this year would be July 2nd. In that scenario CFL Weekend 18 becomes October 31/Nov 1. 18 week schedule = no byes although with 9 teams somebody needs to have the week off.

Damned if they do, damned if they don't. Keep in mind Canada Day is one of those stats that moves around not necessarily falling on a weekend. It can also fall in the middle of the week meaning there is no real Canada Day Weekend, just a one day Canada Day. Want to make Canada Day the start of the season then you have to be prepared to eliminate byes forcing all teams to play 3 games in 9 or 10 days at some point(s) during the season or push Grey Cup out into December. The CFL who feels bye weeks are beneficial to player safety and reducing injuries wouldl never get the PA to drop the bye weeks now that they have them. For many players from both sides of the border those bye weeks are the only opportunities they have to get a few days in with their families in the 6 months from when they leave for training camp until the season is over.
Just play the season opener on July 1 if it falls
midweek and the rest of Week 1 on the weekend. It would be fairly easy to schedule coming out of training camp. I like the idea of Ottawa and Montreal as annual Canada Day rivals but there may be too many other Canada Day activities in Ottawa to make a game at TD Place practical.

TV schedules and byes are more complicated. TSN likes having at least 20 weeks of regular season football. Players will expect at least two byes, even with the addition of a 10th team. Using this year‘s calendar as an example, a 20-week schedule beginning July 1 would push Grey Cup to Dec. 6.


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Re: why is CFL interest so tepid in toronto?

B.C.FAN wrote:
Mon May 25, 2020 11:18 am
Just play the season opener on July 1 if it falls
midweek and the rest of Week 1 on the weekend. It would be fairly easy to schedule coming out of training camp. I like the idea of Ottawa and Montreal as annual Canada Day rivals but there may be too many other Canada Day activities in Ottawa to make a game at TD Place practical.
That still doesn't overcome the scheduling issue of only having 18 weeks to play all games while still allowing for Grey Cup to be held 3rd or 4th Sunday in November. Now if the CFL lost a team or gained a team to have an even number and brow beat the PA into no byes it could be pulled off. But with 9 teams byes are necessary. Even with 2 byes one team drew the short straw and had to play 2 game in one week. For some reason it was usually the Argos who drew that short straw.


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Re: why is CFL interest so tepid in toronto?

thanks for all the excellent comments :)

i agree with one of the final comments about extremely successful people. i've known some billionaires and some guys who made > $10MM per year before they were 40.

i also find that these people hustle like crazy........ why can't they have 100% market share in what they do? why would any client want to do their business with another firm? the idea is insane to them.

if they owned the lions, instead of wondering "why aren't there that many fans of chinese-origin at lions games?". or "why aren't all those people living in apartments/buildings with 5 miles coming to the games much?".... they'd think "why aren't those people coming in droves?".... don't get me wrong, they might be proven wrong too. but i think they'd really try.............

have the lions done stuff with some chinese-origin marketing people/bloggers?... i understand there are many waves of chinese/HK immigration to BC/Vancouver. so somebody who's great great grand-father worked building railway is not the same as someone coming from china today. but i think both these chinese/canadian waves don't fit into the whole "descended from dal richards/jack cullen/red robinson fans" group which is a big portion of the current fan base that comes to watch games at BC Place.... i have lots of friends in the long-term chinese canadians and i went to UBC in 1980s when there were many students from that demographic (and it seemed like very few recent arrivals from HK)

i also agree with one comment about argos and toronto......... the ratio of "CFL/argos fans" to actual attendance is massive... places like sask, winnipeg (or even lincoln nebraska and the cornhuskers) that ratio is much much lower............ i think there is alot of interest in CFL in toronto. just doesn't translate to actual attendance............

i could also write a 500 page book on leafs fan base vs. raptors fan base (i mean ardent fans. most people in toronto are somewhat interested in both).......

raptors are funny in that they had rabid fan interest and good attendance and great arena experience through many years of poor play, but it never showed up in TV ratings and ultimately TV revenue. i could never understand it. of course, not sure that many NBA teams have good local/regional TV contracts (it is very top-heavy, i.e. lakers, knicks.... huge markets)


cms22
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Re: why is CFL interest so tepid in toronto?

the league needs to fix toronto, BC and montreal.......

wondering if MLSE might want some sort of beach-head in BC, montreal......

will the league be more canadian after a government bailout?


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Re: why is CFL interest so tepid in toronto?

cms22 wrote:
Fri May 29, 2020 4:08 pm
the league needs to fix toronto, BC and montreal.......

wondering if MLSE might want some sort of beach-head in BC, montreal......

will the league be more canadian after a government bailout?
I don't think the CFL falls into Trudeau's support base. Trudeau only cares about urban voters in Vancouver, Montreal and Toronto.

I think back to the '80s/'90s/'00s and NFL was not widely broadcast in Canada as it is today. So the CFL had the football viewer more or less "to themselves". Now you have NFL TV coverage in Canada surpassing that of CFL, and with population demographics changing, the CFL fan base is not as large as it used to be. Look at the fan base of MLS teams in Montreal, Toronto and Vancouver. How many are new Canadians, and how many are multi-generational Canadians. There's your answer.


Murdoch
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Re: why is CFL interest so tepid in toronto?

cms22 wrote:
Fri May 29, 2020 4:08 pm
the league needs to fix toronto, BC and montreal.......

wondering if MLSE might want some sort of beach-head in BC, montreal......

will the league be more canadian after a government bailout?
The league is battling itself on this issue by taking the television revenue they depend on and still wanting people to attend games in person at premium prices. Some will.

I am of the opinion there are many good CFL fans in all three cities you mentioned. Trend today seems to be moving to watch from home. I've heard the CFL has a strong tv audience in Toronto and would think the same for all CFL cities.

Answer in my opinion is to make the games less expensive to attend. CFL was built on $15 ticket sales but is not doing so well since they started thinking the fans will pay anything. (ie Grey Cup ticket prices).

Regards to all. Enjoy your day.


Murdoch
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Re: why is CFL interest so tepid in toronto?

cms22 wrote:
Fri May 29, 2020 4:08 pm
the league needs to fix toronto, BC and montreal.......

wondering if MLSE might want some sort of beach-head in BC, montreal......

will the league be more canadian after a government bailout?
The league is moving towards being less Canadian and should think about that aspect as well imo.

Not only with the Global initiative but also with the National status designations related to parents place of birth and declaring players who have never lived in Canada as Nationals.

Also something now about international players being allowed to work in Canada outside football which seems like an immigration loophole. Why?


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