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I wonder what the Bomber's equivalent of the Lionbackers are saying about their coaches. Are they as negative as the Lionbackers are about their team's coaches? The Bombers HC O'Shea does have an interesting if not questionable strategy to improve his team's performance: That is, de-activate your top running back (then cut hm) and one of your most productive receivers. So if the Lions' coaches attempt to duplicate this strategy, then that would mean in the near future de-activating Arceneaux and Logan (now that Harris is gone). Will that make the team better? From this strategy I conclude that the Blue Bombers have a lot more "coaching problems" by far than the Lions. How long will O'Shea last?

The Bomber fans are mad at Grigsby for asking for his release so they are glad that he is gone.

I think O'Shea is trying to change the culture to one of discipline and accountability and winning.

Apparently it cannot be accomplished in just one season.

Every one says RBs are plentiful and easy to replace. Great ones, not so much but Grigcby was never all that great, imo.

DanoT wrote:The Bomber fans are mad at Grigsby for asking for his release so they are glad that he is gone.

I think O'Shea is trying to change the culture to one of discipline and accountability and winning.

Apparently it cannot be accomplished in just one season.

Every one says RBs are plentiful and easy to replace. Great ones, not so much but Grigcby was never all that great, imo.

Well, he does not appear to be succeeding very well with whatever it is he is trying to do. The Bombers have lost 8 of their last 9 games! Next week is the Lions' big opportunity against Winnipeg. If they win 9 games this season they are in the post-season. There is absolutely no way all 3 Eastern contenders (Hamilton, Toronto and Montreal) are all going to win 9 games this season (mathematically possible I suppose but very unlikely).

Bomber fans knew we lacked talent on the OL, DL and our LB's were too small. Add to that inconsistency at receiver and RB, we are not surprised on this major slide.


However, going into TC most felt both our OC and DC were not up to the task. We've been let down even more by our ST coaches.

Now there is a quesion whether all the hoopla about Miller and Walters was justified prior to TC. I wasn't a big supporter of either of those guys, particularly Walters.

Not sure why Kelly was benched but he was inconsistent and seemed to bounce receptions into int's. That said, Bryant has done squat so I wonder why we aren't just starting a pure rookie as an auditon for 2015.

This week, Willy and January have gone to 1 game IR. Kromah, Woods and Hickman gone to PR. We're starting Brohm and a rookie import at LT and reportedly starting 1st ound draft pick Goossen at RG.

Not looking forwad to this game anymore than the last two blowouts. Yikes.!!

ballhawk wrote:I wonder what the Bomber's equivalent of the Lionbackers are saying about their coaches. Are they as negative as the Lionbackers are about their team's coaches?

"I think this is an excellent way to start a discussion."

Blue In BC wrote:. We've been let down even more by our ST coaches.

As always, the first question I ask when I see this is, is it really a function of coaching, or is it first and foremost a product of a lack of talent/depth due to poor player personnel acquisitions?

cromartie wrote:

Blue In BC wrote:. We've been let down even more by our ST coaches.

As always, the first question I ask when I see this is, is it really a function of coaching, or is it first and foremost a product of a lack of talent/depth due to poor player personnel acquisitions?

I have been trained to suggest that it is the player execution that lacks, but I am a Lion's fan.

ballhawk wrote:I wonder what the Bomber's equivalent of the Lionbackers are saying about their coaches. Are they as negative as the Lionbackers are about their team's coaches? The Bombers HC O'Shea does have an interesting if not questionable strategy to improve his team's performance: That is, de-activate your top running back (then cut hm) and one of your most productive receivers. So if the Lions' coaches attempt to duplicate this strategy, then that would mean in the near future de-activating Arceneaux and Logan (now that Harris is gone). Will that make the team better? From this strategy I conclude that the Blue Bombers have a lot more "coaching problems" by far than the Lions. How long will O'Shea last?

The Bombers problems and Lions problems aren't even close to analogous, so the entire premise of your question is really a poorly veiled attempt to get pissy about how the posters on Lionbackers rightfully hold the coaching staff accountable for their micro and macro decision making. And this is before we get to how little you know about what is actually going on in Winnipeg.

I award your trolling efforts zero points, and may whatever deity you take pains to believe in have mercy on your soul.

I think the Bombers need to upgrade players in a lot of positions, but improving scouting, drafting, and evaluations take time. This is why I was very surprised with the Bombers quick start to the season and was more or less expecting their more recent play.

It would be a big mistake for the Bombers to fire O'Shea. Who else is out there to replace him?

DanoT wrote: It would be a big mistake for the Bombers to fire O'Shea. Who else is out there to replace him?

Can we make a trade much like the Canuck's Alain Vigneault going to the Rangers and Tortorella coming west ? Benevides for O'Shea and we'll throw in Chuck McMann and Dan Dorazio

TheLionKing wrote:Can we make a trade much like the Canuck's Alain Vigneault going to the Rangers and Tortorella coming west ? Benevides for O'Shea and we'll throw in Chuck McMann and Dan Dorazio

Now that would be a good deal (for the Lions).
The Bombers problems have come from mainly injuries to Drew Willy. The back-up QB's are completely inadequate. As a result, he tried to return from his injuries far too soon. (I'm not sure who's fault that is though, Willy insisting he can play, or coaching pressuring him to play).

I don't see the Bombers winning any more games this season. Brian Brohm will likely be the starter for the foreseeable future, unless Willy tries to come back again too soon from his hand injury.

I found O'Shea's coaching decision to bench Grigsby and Kelly very odd, especially (in hindsight) when you consider how few yards Paris Cotton got in the Edmonton game, and how little receiving punch the Blue Bombers had in that game. Therefore I wondered how extreme the Bombers fan base might have been to that coaching decision and what they were saying about their HC.

I thought both Rick Campbell and O'Shea would rise to be quicker, bright stars but neither has the public narrative that intrigues me like other new coaches in the CFL had.

Campbell seems not to make the adjustments in game or planning to give his offense a chance and execution lacks due to skill. BUT a HC has to do like Austin did on his arrival. Get them believing but give them the tools they need to make something start to happen. I think change can be made sooner than most think.

O'Shea in public that I read is not sounding focused brilliantly but I have not heard or read him much.


Grigsy is not unique in that many players in all sports think short term and can't control their emotions like that when they feel they are being dissed like that by sitting out.

I recall this HC who I assisted in soccer who when we were down 2 to 0 and getting beaten even worse than the score told me (assistant) after the half with some 25 minutes to go told me to take out 2 players and put in subs of lesser ability. I was horrified and said WTF these are the two best guys today!! We took them out and I was told to explain why. I took them aside and they weren't swallowing how they were not the problem but this was a message to the team. These two grabbed their bags and started to walk away when we scored. They stopped and walked on a bit more and we scored again and they came back.

Now it was OT and we put them back in and we scored two more (no golden goal) and we beat this other team who had at the half unloaded their bench and put in all 5 subs and some guys on the field by end of OT were dead. It was the old Pacific Coast League where the u/23's were just finishing our schedule in Spring and the open was just starting so to determine berths in the Provincial playdown we ended up playing the open teams.

Was Grigsby a way to send a message - now one of a different kind like this HC did ? Now the message is you quit so go... less effective than sitting a star as players think holy bleep... if he is sitting that guy ... what does he think of me?!! I'd best be playing top level.

DanoT wrote:I think the Bombers need to upgrade players in a lot of positions, but improving scouting, drafting, and evaluations take time. This is why I was very surprised with the Bombers quick start to the season and was more or less expecting their more recent play.

It would be a big mistake for the Bombers to fire O'Shea. Who else is out there to replace him?

I was STUNNED at how the BOmbers came out of the gate. I also think firing O'Shea would be a big mistake. Lots of the head coaching positions recently have gone to people more geared towards the defensive aspect of football (Benevides, Reed, O'Shea, Jones). I really liked what O'Shea offered the Argos on Specials when he was coaching there. Given time, I think the fact he's an ex-player, combined with more time seasoning as a coach, he'll do just fine.......

notahomer wrote:

DanoT wrote:I think the Bombers need to upgrade players in a lot of positions, but improving scouting, drafting, and evaluations take time. This is why I was very surprised with the Bombers quick start to the season and was more or less expecting their more recent play.

It would be a big mistake for the Bombers to fire O'Shea. Who else is out there to replace him?

I was STUNNED at how the BOmbers came out of the gate. I also think firing O'Shea would be a big mistake. Lots of the head coaching positions recently have gone to people more geared towards the defensive aspect of football (Benevides, Reed, O'Shea, Jones). I really liked what O'Shea offered the Argos on Specials when he was coaching there. Given time, I think the fact he's an ex-player, combined with more time seasoning as a coach, he'll do just fine.......

Most coaches are ex-players but there is one aspect of ex-player that must be removed from a coach's mindset OR he/she won't be successful.

That is the coach must no longer think like a player. It took me some years to realize this as I used to coach kids as an active player myself and I'd coach to my playing style. I was not fully successful as in reality as I more of a player coach even though they were younger.

When I started to watch the Whitecaps (old regime) train under Tony Waiters as well as attend his clinics it occurred to me where I was flawed in my thinking and approach. I needed to have a big picture vision of how a team should be playing and fit system and style to players not players to system - although some aspects of the game are fine to be imposed such as ways of defending corner kicks, free kicks and attacking in those situations.

When I arrived in HK in late Sept 2007 I watched a high school team with a young coach showing them how to kick corners and take free kicks. This was about 1.5 hour before they played a cup game. As I watched this guy - thinking wow... he is as I was - showing and modeling exactly what he wanted done. I knew it had to be a game as they were in unis. Then their opponent drifted in and their guys hung out together chatting and about 50 min. before the game they started to dress without direction. A few min later their HC arrives and by 30 min. before kickoff they were all in various stages of warm up and stretching gradually leading up to when the ref/linesman called for the line up checks they were ready.

Meanwhile the Chinese duplicate of me was not as organized and there was confusion as they were sent off to get shin guards etc and it didn't look organized as he did his last minute line up call and it was not good. He was barking positions out from the sideline as the game started.

Talent wise the young guys team was better especially ONE kid. I now don't want to leave as I thought the lesser team warm up was like my teams did it - pro style and they just seem really well organized and timed like how I did it in my prime. Line up before ref checks where I give the starting line up and final words - then ref checks. Then final reminder instructions and the game is on.

The lesser team won and it started from the get go. The problem with the other guy is that their free kicks and corner kicks they did over and over weren't happening in the game as the opponent didn't give them these chances.

After the game was over I spoke to a few of the players who were on the same way out of the park as I was and sure enough their coach had it all so timed and organized they didn't need to be told. There was no last minute (oh oh - go get shin guards) like the other coach.

BUT that other coach was a skilful player who no doubt like me in my day was active on a team and a good player.

The organized coach didn't look like much of an athlete but he kept his instructions simple and their off field mirrored their on field performance and despite the lesser team they won. Half time as his team comes off the young guy is instructing and coaching and his players have yet to catch their breath. The other coach had his guys relaxed - get drinks - cool off and then after a few minutes he focused them and went over a few key issues and back out they went. The other guy was too instructional and was coaching (things that should have been done in practice).

To get back in the game the young guy who his star at the back put him up front and immediately the other coach with minimal instruction from the side line man marked him and went 3 at the back - pretty much ending the star's day.

OShea was brilliant as an ST coach. Innovative, inspirational and instructional. Their ST took the field and you knew something could and might happen. It was not a routine punt ever. This stuff is something that he can do less of directly as a HC as his role is now different and he is coaching coaches and setting an overall direction and culture. Some can never adjust to the HC role and so they end up still calling the plays on either offense or defense.