2006 BC Lions vs. 1985 BC Lions

[Robbie]

By contrast, the 1994 and 2000 Grey Cup teams had only three CFL All-Stars:

1994 BC Lion CFL All-Stars
FB - Sean Millington
CB - Less Browne
DB - Charles Gordon

2000 BC Lion CFL All-Stars
RB - Sean Millington
OT - Chris Perez
K - Lui Passaglia

[Blitz]

Well the 64 team went from heros to out of the playoffs the following season

That can happen Rammer... but we're not looking at length of domination but the best single season team...at least I thought that was what we were looking at anyway!

The Leos 64 team had the best single season record....Peanut Butter Joe went on to the NFL, Willie Fleming's average yard per carry was so phenomenal that he may have been our most talented back ever, the recievers were quality, and the Headhunters defense, led by Tom Brown and Norm Fieldgate were an intimidating group. I'd say this 2006 team had the most depth, and the 85 team were an exciting team to watch but the '64 Leos were the most dominant team, in terms of it's competition.... and the players from that team have endured most in Leos folklore.

Anyway....the topic is quite subjective but in terms of uniforms...there is no subjectivity required.....the '64 uniforms were the best!!!

[Rammer]

Well the 64 team went from heros to out of the playoffs the following season

That can happen Rammer... but we're not looking at length of domination but the best single season team...at least I thought that was what we were looking at anyway!

The Leos 64 team had the best single season record....Peanut Butter Joe went on to the NFL, Willie Fleming's average yard per carry was so phenomenal that he may have been our most talented back ever, the recievers were quality, and the Headhunters defense, led by Tom Brown and Norm Fieldgate were an intimidating group. I'd say this 2006 team had the most depth, and the 85 team were an exciting team to watch but the '64 Leos were the most dominant team, in terms of it's competition.... and the players from that team have endured most in Leos folklore.

Anyway....the topic is quite subjective but in terms of uniforms...there is no subjectivity required.....the '64 uniforms were the best!!!

WE are looking at that, but since there wasn't much transition between seasons, being the best to not in the mix come playoffs hurts the level of game the 64 team did have, IMO.

AS for folklore, that is only a matter of time that we are talking about the Simons, Clermonts, Dickensons, Williams, Floyds and Johnsons of 06 - ???, subjective fis the best call. But the determining factor is exactly what you brought up, the 06 depth makes this edition of the Lions the best "TEAM" in Lion history in my eyes.

Regardless of uniforms or not. lol Besides those thirds with the winning orange paw helmet looks pretty swet in my eyes

[OV - 54:40]

The 64 team had 6 CFL all-stars (and they didn't name kickers back then - Beaumont was the top West punter) and Willie Flemming - maybe the all-time best CFL RB - didn't make the all-star team. And they won the GC by 10 points over a Ticat team that was 10-3-1 that season (compared to the mediocre East Champ Als this past season). Sorry, IMO, the 64 team was best and 94's team (if McManus had started that GC maybe they blow-out the Stallions; Philpot & Millington were a dynamite backfield duo, Ray Alexander was an awesome receiver; Petersen, Less Browne, Wilburn, Snipes, Europe, Stewart on the D) was up there too; but yeah - hard to compare the different eras and styles of play and opponents.

[Robbie]

The 64 team had 6 CFL all-stars

Right, I forgot to mention them:

QB - Joe Kapp
OT - Lonnie Dennis
DT - Mike Cacic
DE - Dick Fouts
MG - Tom Brown
DB - Bill Munsey

So only two all-stars were on offence, while four were on defence.

94's team (if McManus had started that GC maybe they blow-out the Stallions

Actually, I don't think it was too much of a difference as the Grey Cup was won mostly by a good running game established by the offence, while the defence made some big plays. Kent Austin actually completed more passes before he was injured at 7-16. Of course, his three interceptions were not good. Danny McManus went 3-7. So I don't think the game would have been a blowout had Danny McManus started. Both QB's supported each other in the 1994 playoffs. In the 1994 West Division Semi-Final against Edmonton, McManus started but was injured. Kent Austin successfully came in for him.

[Robbie]

2006 BC Lion CFL All-Stars
WR - Geroy Simon
OT - Rob Murphy
DE - Brent Johnson
DT - Tyrone Williams
LB - Otis Floyd
DB - Korey Banks
DS - Barron Miles

Of these seven players, all but Rob Murphy were selected to the CFLPA All-Star team too.

We'll find out tonight whether Buono will be selected coach of the year.

[Robbie]

We'll find out tonight whether Buono will be selected coach of the year.

With Buono winning coach of the year honours, then that makes the 1985 to 2006 team nearly identical in so many wins. Both teams finished with 13 wins and the Grey Cup, player awards, and now the league's best coach. 1985 was the first in a total of five coach of the year awards that Don Matthews won. Buono is still behind him with his third award.

[120dB]

'85 team drew bigger crowds

In '83 the average attendance was 45,550 including 3 sellouts

[Robbie]

Gordon McIntyre from The Province also provided his own comparison:

http://www.canada.com/theprovince/news/ ... =34488&p=2

Superficially, there are many shared characteristics between the 1985 and 2006 Cup champs, including:

- The Lions lose to an underdog Argos team two years previous and lose the West final at home the next year.

- The Lions win 13 games to finish first in the West for the third straight year.

- The most outstanding player (Mervyn Fernandez, Geroy Simon), the rookie of the year (Mitchell Gray, Aaron Hunt) and coach of the year (Don Matthews, Wally Buono) all hail from the Lions, as do seven CFL all-stars.

- A dominating Canadian at DE (Nick Hebeler, Brent Johnson), a position usually excelled at by Americans.

- The Lions win the West final against a team that had beaten them three times in the regular season (Winnipeg in '85, Saskatchewan in '06).

- Matthews and Buono are the two winningest coaches in CFL history and sure-bet Hall of Famers.

And both squads carried themselves with a swagger. That cockiness wavered a bit in 1985, though, when Fernandez and all-star running back Keyvan Jenkins were lost for the playoffs.


1985 VS. 2006

Here's how the 1985 Lions stack up against the 2006 squad:

QUARTERBACK

2006: Dave Dickenson, too, has his detractors and, as in Dewalt's case, it took a Grey Cup win to (somewhat) silence them. Buck Pierce and Jarious Jackson gave the 2006 squad unprecedented depth.

Edge: 2006

BACKFIELD

1985: Keyvan Jenkins was a CFL all-star and John Henry White was as solid a fullback as there was.

2006: Joe Smith added another dimension to the offence after he replaced Antonio Warren.

Edge: 1985

OFFENSIVE LINE

1985: The hogs were all-Canadian bacon and, anchored by centre Al Wilson, were probably the best five-man unit in the CFL. John Blain was a CFL all-star.

2006: With the additions of imports Rob Murphy and Jason Jimenez at ends last year, the Lions became a dominant force in the trench. Murphy was the top offensive lineman in the CFL.

Edge: 2006

RECEIVER

1985: Not many could match all-star Swervin' Mervyn Fernandez's big-play potential. He was supported by a cast that included Jim Sandusky, playoff hero Ned Armour and John Pankratz.

2006: Geroy Simon was the CFL's outstanding player. Jason Clermont and Tony Simmons were injured much of the year, Paris Jackson stepped up big-time in the playoffs, but the Lions didn't think it was worth re-signing Ryan Thelwell for 2007.

Edge: 1985

LINEBACKER

1985: Tyrone Crews, CFL all-star Kevin Konar and West all-star Glen Jackson were a fearsome threesome.

2006: Javy Glatt, a budding all-star, made people forget Barrin Simpson. Otis Floyd was an all-star, but Carl Kidd wasn't good enough to make the team the next year.

Edge: 1985

SECONDARY

1985: Darnell Clash was a CFL all-star and Mel Byrd a West all-star. Keith Gooch, Corey Parker and Nelson Martin rounded out a fast defensive backfield.

2006: Barron Miles led one of the best secondaries in league history, Kerry Banks joined him as a CFL all-star and Dante Marsh garnered West all-star honours.

Edge: 2006

FRONT FOUR

1985: CFL all-star James (Quick) Parker and SFU grad Nick Hebeler were formidable bookends, Rick Klassen put pressure up the middle.

2006: Brent Johnson was the league's top Canadian and defensive player, Tyrone Williams joined him as a CFL all-star, while Aaron Hunt was rookie-of-the-year and a West all-star.

Edge: It's a push

SPECIAL TEAMS

1985: Lui Passaglia was in his prime, Darnell Clash was an explosive returner.

2006: Paul McCallum was the top Canadian in the Grey Cup.

Edge: 1985

COACH

1985: Don Matthews was a rookie head coach who'd honed his skills as an assistant with the Eskimos dynasty. He became the CFL's all-time winningest coach, but is just 5-4 in Grey Cups.

2006: Wally Buono is second behind Matthews in career wins an just behind in Grey Cups at 4-4.

[Rammer]

yet when Lui was asked which team he thought would win out between 85 and 06, he said that size and speed of the current 06 team is dominating, yet the crafty vets they had in the 85 team would make a game of it. In my mind the 06 team has evolved to a point that no other team has since, our 07 team is better in ST's, but lacking the offense of 06 so far.

[Luke]

As for ownership, I'd say the private ownership under David Braley has brought the team much more stability to the team than the community ownership that held the team until 1989.

Wow. I didn't know the Lions were ever community owned. What led to private ownership in '89?

[Rammer]

As for ownership, I'd say the private ownership under David Braley has brought the team much more stability to the team than the community ownership that held the team until 1989.

Wow. I didn't know the Lions were ever community owned. What led to private ownership in '89?

Murray Pezim.....sigh.

[Luke]

As for ownership, I'd say the private ownership under David Braley has brought the team much more stability to the team than the community ownership that held the team until 1989.

Wow. I didn't know the Lions were ever community owned. What led to private ownership in '89?

Murray Pezim.....sigh.

Yeah. Murray Pezim bought the team in 1989, but what led to that? Was the city or province losing too much money? Did Murray Pezim think he was getting a gold mine, and so he pursued the team, even though the province or the city wasn't interested in selling? What exactly happened?

It sounds like you preferred community ownership, Rammer?

[Robbie]

Wow. I didn't know the Lions were ever community owned. What led to private ownership in '89?

Murray Pezim.....sigh.

Yeah. Murray Pezim bought the team in 1989, but what led to that? Was the city or province losing too much money? Did Murray Pezim think he was getting a gold mine, and so he pursued the team, even though the province or the city wasn't interested in selling? What exactly happened?

It sounds like you preferred community ownership, Rammer?

I think the team needed a private owner because community ownership could no longer support it.

Remember that Murray Pezim was not the original interested buyer. Originally, Jimmy Pattison was interested in buying the team, but the deal fell through, as did negotiations with the next interested buyer, Stephen Funk. I think they couldn't reach an agreement because they had very heavy demands, such as control over BC Place Stadium as well.

[Ravi]

Gordon McIntyre from The Province also provided his own comparison:

http://www.canada.com/theprovince/news/ ... =34488&p=2

Superficially, there are many shared characteristics between the 1985 and 2006 Cup champs, including:

- The Lions lose to an underdog Argos team two years previous and lose the West final at home the next year.

While I will accept that the '04 Argos were an underdog, the 1983 Argos definitely were not. They had defeated the Lions twice during the '83 regular season including a convincing win right at B.C. Place (the only regular season game that the Lions would lose at home that season). The '83 Argos also had a 12-4 regular season record which was better than the 11-5 Lions.