Steep Price for Exceeding Cap

[PigSkin_53]

http://www.tsn.ca/cfl/news_story/?ID=227649&hubname=

Looks like the Riders and Als will pay a steep price for not paying more attention to their books.

I don't have much sympathy for Tillman's crybaby routine, nor buy that the Riders led the league in missed games due to injuries. That statement can be skewed as the Lions had perhaps more injuries at key positions but kept on playing hurt, while Tillman brought in fresh bodies so as his starting personnel got healthier all the sooner.

As far as Montreal still having Saskatchewan’s 1st round pick (due to a previous trade consideration) after loosing their own, my take on this is, if the Rider's 1st round pick is taken from them before this season's draft occurs, then Montreal should be either forced to take their second round pick, or wait until the 2009 college draft to retain their rights on the original 1st round trade pick from Saskatchewan, taken from them this season.

[DerekDD]

http://www.tsn.ca/cfl/news_story/?ID=227720&hubname=cfl

The Canadian Football League and the Saskatchewan Roughriders flatly denied Friday's report that the Riders and Montreal Alouettes were over the league's salary cap for the 2007 season.

"The audit of the league's teams is still underway and the results are still not known," the CFL said in a statement on Saturday. "Those results will not be available until April. Until that time, speculation on the outcome of the audit is just that: speculation that is not supported by the facts."

On Friday, it was reported that the Roughriders exceeded the $4.05 million salary cap and would have to forfeit their first round pick in this year's Canadian College Draft.

Roughriders general manager Eric Tillman also disputed the report, telling the Regina Leader Post that no team worked harder at cutting salary in preparation for the 2007 campaign.

"We've stated multiple times the only reason we are even in any jeopardy of exceeding the cap is our league-leading injury list," Tillman told the Leader Post. "We took drastic measures in the off-season, trading or releasing more than a dozen players, to be in compliance with the cap, which we as an organization totally support."

"So, if accuracy matters, let's acknowledge two facts: One, we led the league in games missed by injured players and two, the league is weeks away from completing the auditing process as it relates to all eight clubs," Tillman added

[Sir Purrcival]

I agree that it is only right and fair to wait to see if in fact any team in this league is actually guilty but if it should turn out that the Rider's are over the cap, then be wary of this. "We had lots of injuries" excuse. The fact is , no one else is really gonna care whether it was injuries, bad management or anything else that causes a team to be over the cap. It is simply going to be "You were over the cap, too bad, so sad, you have to pay the piper". If you try to hide behind that excuse, then everybody is gonna try and hide behind it. I think Tillman has made a tactical error in going this route and there are some subtle signs even from some Rider leaning fans that they are not altogether enthused about what is become an excuse making trend from Mr. Tillman.

Every team has injuries but how you deal with those injuries determines how much you end of spending. There is a part of me that is beginning to wonder if Mr. Austin was incredibly smart to get out the fishbowl before the glass shatters.

The Riders are on top for the moment but we'll see how long Mr. Tillman's act flies when the stars don't line up quite as nicely as they did this year.

[DerekDD]

The stars lined up for the Riders this year? Are you kidding? They were the most injured team in the league yet still managed to win it all. Need I remind you, the Lions were the team with the home Western Final game and the Riders went into BC and won.

[notahomer]

The stars lined up for the Riders this year? Are you kidding? They were the most injured team in the league yet still managed to win it all. Need I remind you, the Lions were the team with the home Western Final game and the Riders went into BC and won.

Lots of words in the english language don't always mean what one may think. Your response to this comment could be percieved as you agreeing with the 'stars' comment. Are you talking about the Riders 'stars'? I'm thinking the 'stars' mentioned have nothing to do with any teams 'stars' on the field.

[Gerry]

The stars lined up for the Riders this year? Are you kidding? They were the most injured team in the league yet still managed to win it all. Need I remind you, the Lions were the team with the home Western Final game and the Riders went into BC and won.

You can say that (that the Riders were the most injured) but that doesn't make it true, or paint an accurate picture. Ask most CFL fans of all teams and they'll say that the Lions were because that is the perception when considering who was injured.

The Riders were the only team in the league to have a healthy starting QB all year. Small wonder that he was the MOP this year as well. They also played a team in the GC with its starting QB out (and just the game prior, so no chance for the Bombers to compensate).

Now, injuries are a part of the game. It is to Joseph's credit that he was able to hang in there all year.

But when considering the year, you have to admit that the stars did line up for some degree for the Riders, as they must to some extent for any team to win a GC.

[Sir Purrcival]

The stars lined up for the Riders this year? Are you kidding? They were the most injured team in the league yet still managed to win it all. Need I remind you, the Lions were the team with the home Western Final game and the Riders went into BC and won.

Lots of words in the english language don't always mean what one may think. Your response to this comment could be percieved as you agreeing with the 'stars' comment. Are you talking about the Riders 'stars'? I'm thinking the 'stars' mentioned have nothing to do with any teams 'stars' on the field.

Quite correct, was referring to the celestial kind, not players on the field. But if you want to interpret it that way how bout mentioning which team got to face a QB in his first start for the big game? The Riders made their way but like many teams that have in the past, there are also elements of fortune that go along with it. Calgary wasn't playing outrageously well to begin with but throwing in a wounded Burris didn't hurt the Riders chances. Neither did facing Jarious Jackson, a QB that had a tepid season by most accounts and our 3rd stringer, followed by a rust encased DD who some Rider fans took immense joy when his "Brain got rattled". The Rider's won and that is fact and their hard work had much to do with their success but don't even try to pretend that there wasn't some good fortune that went hand in hand with that success.

[Solar Max]

For some unknown reason, DerekDD seems to be obsessed with justifying an alleged SMS violation wherever he can; this is somewhat puzzling.

You won a Grey Cup, you don't need to justify anything. Your constant "SEE, SEE! Braley Cheats!! Lions are evil!" posts and threads are a little over the top, IMO.

It doesn't make your victory any greater by throwing unsubstantiated rumours out, and in fact, makes you look like you feel you feel your team has something to hide.

Chill, and enjoy. Tillman will do what he always does, no matter how many boards you blame the Lions on. You won, now be a gracious victor.

[ilovetheriders]

All that matters is The Riders won the Grey Cup. Penalizing teams that go over who have injuries is wrong but hey its like that for every team. It could happen to a different team this year. As for Tillman, I have the utmost confidence in him. Suggesting that Austin got out because he knew things were going to fall apart is crazy talk.

[Sir Purrcival]

I didn't mean to imply that the Riders were in imminent danger of falling apart but as I read my post, I can see how that could be the interpretation. What I did mean was that the Riders will decline at some point and that it was smarter for Austin to get out now while he is on top. We know how merciless Rider fans can be when things aren't going so well. Expectations are high for next season as a result of this seasons success. Somehow when the tumble does unfold, I'm not sure how long Mr. Tillmans act will wash with Rider fans. He has done a good job but somehow I think it is easier to say that during good times. We'll see how much slack Rider fans will give him after say a 3 or 4 game slide. I don't think they will be nearly as supportive of his style when that happens. The only reason I say that is that he seems to be the only GM who seems to say anything most of the time and somehow it always seems to come off as lacking something bordering on the irritating. Strictly a personal feeling thing for the most part but time will tell.

[Hambone]

You can say that (that the Riders were the most injured) but that doesn't make it true, or paint an accurate picture. Ask most CFL fans of all teams and they'll say that the Lions were because that is the perception when considering who was injured.

The Riders were the only team in the league to have a healthy starting QB all year. Small wonder that he was the MOP this year as well. They also played a team in the GC with its starting QB out (and just the game prior, so no chance for the Bombers to compensate).

Now, injuries are a part of the game. It is to Joseph's credit that he was able to hang in there all year.

But when considering the year, you have to admit that the stars did line up for some degree for the Riders, as they must to some extent for any team to win a GC.

From the few other forums I frequent I'd say the only CFL fans who think the Lions were "the most injured" are Lions' fans. I think if one polled around the league they'd probably find most fans felt their team was hit the hardest by injuries. As a Lions' fan I don't think they suffered that badly at all aside from the QB position and Dante Marsh. They had a few guys here and there that had to miss a game or two and some who played hurt. But that's normal stuff for all teams. Aside from the aforementioned there was nothing that created a gaping hole that they didn't have someone capable of filling. Most Eskimo fans are convinced the Esks injury situation was the worst in the league. Obviously Rider fans feel they had it the worst. True Joseph stayed healthy all year, but that was the first time that has happened in his CFL career. We never hear much from the eastern teams but I recall the Argos having a horrendous bunch of injuries to overcome as well. Their starting QB Bishop missed 5 games, Arland Bruce missed 4 games, Tony Miles missed 8 and Mookie Mitchell missed 6 through September and October. All told they had 23 different players catch balls and 13 non-QBs register carries. Robert Edwards played in 9 games leading all their RBs. It's amazing that the Argos finished as strong as they did with the revolving door at the offensive skill positions. By comparison BC had 14 different players register a reception and 6 non-QBs register a carry. I'm sorry but the Lions were downright healthy compared the the Argos.

[Soundy]

Really though, "most injured team" is pretty easy to quantify: add up the number of games missed to injury for each player, and you have a nice solid figure to compare. If you wanted to get really picky you could add minutes if a player misses a couple drives with a muscle pull or something, but that's a bit over the top.

And no, I'm not gonna claim the Lions were "most injured" without seeing those numbers, and no, I'm not gonna do the math for anyone, since it's really not important. If someone else wants to look up the stats and total them up, I'd be interested in the results, but only so the "debate" can be put to rest.

Of course, HOW BADLY certain injuries affect a team is entirely subjective... one could argue that the Lions starting QB missing, what was it, 13 or 14 games? makes the Lions a lot "more injured" than another team whose, say, third-string safety gets his season ended on the first play of the first pre-season game, even though the raw numbers would disagree...

Or maybe not.

[Canuck_4_Life]

While injury severity does play a key factor in whether a team goes over said cap, however, I believe that that the name on the back of the jersey plays a bigger factor.

Let's use Kennedy Nkeyasen, from the GC Champs as the Rider representative, and Dante Marsh from our Lions as the counterpoint.

Due respect to Rider fans and Nkeyasen (and I like guys that are underappreciated), but how much of an impact would he have had, if he had stayed healthy for the entire season. On the flip side, had the Lions not lost Dante Marsh for 9 weeks, how much more of an impact would he have had?

Further to that, having "affordable" depth in the SMS age is becoming more and more key. Obviously, the Lions situation was not normal, having 600K tied up in 2 QBs, but it was what it was. Perhaps more indicative was the injuries in the secondary (Banks, Miles and Marsh) that occured during the season. Glover and Washington both showed their abilities to play multiple positions in short periods of time, while guys got healthy. Sure, they got burned once in a while, but that's to be expected if you're playing out of position.

[DerekDD]

What I did mean was that the Riders will decline at some point and that it was smarter for Austin to get out now while he is on top. We know how merciless Rider fans can be when things aren't going so well. Expectations are high for next season as a result of this seasons success. Somehow when the tumble does unfold, I'm not sure how long Mr. Tillmans act will wash with Rider fans. He has done a good job but somehow I think it is easier to say that during good times. We'll see how much slack Rider fans will give him after say a 3 or 4 game slide. I don't think they will be nearly as supportive of his style when that happens. Strictly a personal feeling thing for the most part but time will tell.

You better be worrying about your own team's inevitable slide, Sir Purrcival. Austin "got out" as you say it because he wanted to do whats best for himself and his family. He is now positioned to move up over time in the NCAA ranks and if he gets a head coaching job down there in the NCAA, it'll be a million dollar a year payday. It has nothing to do with "going out on top." He was looking forward to trying to repeat up here as he's ultra-competitive; the mere fact you'd suggest he's "trying to go out on top" is laughable.

As for your talk on organizations and decline, your team's front-loaded contracts run out after this year. Ask Rammer. He readily admits this. Have fun trying to re-sign those guys next year as the loophole of the front-loaded contracts is now closed. Guess what? The Lions won't be able to so try and enjoy the 2008 season as the turnover for your team in 2009 will be massive.

Speaking of turnover, every key guy in your organization is old. Buono is a great coach but he's old and has but a few years left. Ackles is old and won't be around forever. You just signed Shivers as player personnel man, an excellent hire but only a short-term band-aid solution as he's almost 70 years old.

If I were you, Sir Purrcival, I'd be more worried about my own team's inevitable decline. Personally I don't want to see the Lions decline too much as I think a strong Lions team is good for the league but you ought to be concerned. Big changes are coming to your team in the next few years. You need some new blood in many different areas.

[Hambone]

Speaking of turnover, every key guy in your organization is old. Buono is a great coach but he's old and has but a few years left. Ackles is old and won't be around forever. You just signed Shivers as player personnel man, an excellent hire but only a short-term band-aid solution as he's almost 70 years old.

I'll give you Ackles being up there, but you can be rest assured he'll have the organization ready for a smooth transition in what I expect will be another 2 or 3 years. As for Buono if he's old and has but a few years left then most of the teams in the league are in the same boat. At 57 he's right in the middle of the current CFL HC age demographic and the 4th oldest coach currently pending of course the Riders' new hire. Doug Berry is 59 and Rich Stubler 58. Charlie Taaffe turns 58 in April while Wally hits 58 during the season. John Hufnagel is 56 and new Als' HC Marc Trestman is 52. Maciocia is the pup (and runt) of the litter at 40.