Bombers 26 - Lions 20, Post-Game Stats and Comments

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DanoT
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Sun Oct 15, 2017 7:00 am

don corleone wrote:
Sun Oct 15, 2017 6:38 am
Attendance was no where near the announced 26,400. > 20,000 would be closer.
Most teams do not announce actual attendance but rather the total number of tickets sold and tickets given away. So season ticket holders who are no shows still get counted.

Dusty
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Sun Oct 15, 2017 9:19 am

I dunno….I guess I just did not listen or watch the game with enough sense of urgency…. I started pretty good, got all the grocery shopping done before kick-off and was home having lunch when the game started… I was watching the stream, but looking back, I just did not have a sense that the game was vital to me….. and I did have to pick up a present for my niece, so switched to listening in the car as I drove to a couple of places….wandered aimlessly through Kids-R-Us and nothing sparked any interest, so I drove to a parking lot near Indigo and listened to the radio while my partner went into the store to look for some books…. that was when I had a bump in my listening game, but when she came back with the books, we drove home.... Ya know, I just couldn’t get into any real flow with my listening or watching…. there were always something else that I thought I should do while the game was on and it just seemed like the game was not all that important… didn’t even listen to the radio post game show….

I mean, I did complete some of the things that I wanted to get done…. I watched or listened to the radio, so the execution was there, but I gotta admit…. I just couldn’t get any flow to it… I guess my “sense of urgency” was not there…..

I’ll go to the next home game, so the execution will be there, but I’m not really excited about it….. gotta admit… my sense of urgency is waning…..

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David
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Sun Oct 15, 2017 10:01 am

Mark Washington. This is a name that evokes strong feelings. He has taken a lot of heat on this board for the weak pass rush, having our linebackers hang way back in coverage too often, poorly timed blitzes, and too much confusion in the secondary. But as I've suspected and Blitz notes above, many of our defensive woes this season could be a product of the master vision, not necessarily Washington's philosophy. They're not necessary his personnel choices either.

This should taken into consideration regarding his head coaching ambitions. Do we want to lose him to another team? Is he head coaching material? Not sure, but if you wanted some insight to his ability to motivate the troops, yesterday's game provided that. With the season on the line, his guys really balled hard. Andrew Harris came motivated yet was frequently swarmed and smacked around pretty good. The much-maligned secondary seemed focused and energized and were laying some good licks, and never looked confused about assignments. No, the pressure wasn't often there (although Nicols has a fairly quick release), but the defense only allowed 12 points, only gave up 172 yards to one of the best passers in the game, despite being on the field for 32:34.


DH :cool:
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Sir Purrcival
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Sun Oct 15, 2017 11:30 am

They may have balled hard yesterday but there have been too many times where that hasn't been the case. Honestly, if I had to choose between Mark Washington and a pretty credible alternative in Paul Lapolice, right now my vote would be squarely in the latter court. I would be really choked if we put time and effort into mentoring a Mark Washington for HC (a post he hasn't in any way proved he is capable of to this point). Dave Dickensen played here, won a cup here, is nearly uniformly acknowledged as having a great football mind and is currently coaching the best team in the league...again. He was more or less dumped by Wally Buono. The lack of vision there was and will continue to be the opportunity that was missed. Despite all his football acumen, there have been too many opportunities for long term stability that have been squandered by Wally Buono in favour of his slanted perspective of good. Mark Washington is a very decent fellow to be sure but he wasn't really the leader in his playing days. As a player he was average and nothing I've seen to date suggests that he would be an outstanding head coach. Just like with Mike Benevides or Jacques Chapdelaine, there is competence but not that intangible that makes some coaches truly great and others just solid. I can't say that I would have done any better than WB but I sure as hell would have made every effort possible to keep DD in the fold. Huff saw the potential, nurtured it and worked it so that DD could step into the head shoes of the Stamps by deftly stepping aside when it appeared DD was ready to take the reigns. He explained his long term vision and gave DD a reason to stay rather than get his HC opportunities elsewhere.

Wally on the other hand, said, we don't think you should play anymore, we won't take that risk so if you want to go elsewhere, feel free to do so. I don't have that much faith in WB's ability to see long term.
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DanoT
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Sun Oct 15, 2017 12:52 pm

Sir Purrcival, I believe that you are overlooking the fact that Dickenson's wife and presumably her parents are from Calgary. She is also an executive for a Calgary oil company. So, he was never going to coach anywhere but Calgary. I believe that as a OC he turned down some HC opportunities elsewhere, deciding to stay in Calgary instead.

IIRC, at the end of Dave's playing career Wally did his usually release prior to expiry date and then when Dickenson played for the Stamps he was less than his normal very effective self.

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WestCoastJoe
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Sun Oct 15, 2017 1:06 pm

https://www.cfl.ca/2017/10/14/bombers-o ... l-stretch/

Let the post-mortems continue.
WINNIPEG — The Winnipeg Blue Bombers moved to 11-4 and clinched a playoff spot with their 26-20 home victory against the BC Lions on Saturday. But in a season where the Bombers have had massive success on offence, it was the team’s defence and special teams that led the way and punched their playoff ticket in Week 17.
Yes. The defence put huge pressure on Jennings. Not getting rid of the ball quickly enough? Is 2 seconds sufficient time to go through reads? We did not have sufficient preparation to deal with that pressure. Jennings continues to throw deep into double coverage. One cannot help but think that is by design. Not much else, if anything, is open. The long passes into the flats get jumped. Teams have our passing routes well scouted. Close coverage on Manny and Burnham. Our receivers do not get separation.

Our pass protection was inadequate. More like a sieve.

The Bombers returned a punt for a TD. They kept Rainey in check on our returns. Our returns do not create any gaps for Rainey. The Bombers easily fielded two pedestrian attempts at onside kicks as the game wound down.
“They’re the ones that won us the game tonight,” Matt Nichols told TSN after the win. “We’ve got to be better on offence. We had a couple injuries at key positions, but we’ve got to be better at filling those spots and continuing to roll as an offence. It always feels great to win. Winning’s never easy, it was a grind. We did a few things we needed to win as offence, but it’s hard for me to really feel great about this one. We need to go back and make sure we get better.”
And our defence, led by Solomon Elimimian played tough. We pounded Harris all night. But Harris is as tough as a Tonka Toy, as they used to say about Walter Payton. There was no quit in our players.
While Nichols admitted the offence needed to pick things up moving forward, one thing that will not be hindering their production is the quarterback’s throwing hand. After leaving last week’s game against the Ticats with an injury to his right hand, Nichols said that things felt good against the Lions despite having to wear a modified glove.

“I felt like the ball was leaving my hand fine,” Nichols said. “I don’t think that it affected my game other than the fact that I could just kind of feel it and it’s there, so that’s a little bit different. But overall I felt like I threw the ball pretty well, and everyone’s out here playing hurt.”
Under the guidance of OC Paul LaPolice and QB Coach Buck Pierce, IMO, Nichols has reached the upper echelon of CFL QBs.

I would agree with the writer that the Bombers defence and STs, rather than their offence, won the game for them.
John Madden's Team Policies: Be on time. Pay attention. Play like hell on game day.

Jimmy Johnson's Game Keys: Protect the ball. Make plays.

Walter Payton's Advice to Kids: Play hard. Play fair. Have fun.

Blitz
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Sun Oct 15, 2017 1:22 pm

Dusty wrote:
Sun Oct 15, 2017 9:19 am
I dunno….I guess I just did not listen or watch the game with enough sense of urgency…. I started pretty good, got all the grocery shopping done before kick-off and was home having lunch when the game started… I was watching the stream, but looking back, I just did not have a sense that the game was vital me….. and I did have to pick up a present for my niece, so switched to listening in the car as I drove to a couple of places….wandered aimlessly through Kids-R-Us and nothing sparked any interest, so I drove to a parking lot near Indigo and listened to the radio while my partner went into the store to look for some books…. that was when I had a bump in my listening game, but when she came back with the books, we drove home.... Ya know, I just couldn’t get into any real flow with my listening or watching…. there were always something else that I thought I should do while the game was on and it just seemed like the game was not all that important… didn’t even listen to the radio post game show….

I mean, I did complete some of the things that I wanted to get done…. I watched or listened to the radio, so the execution was there, but I gotta admit…. I just couldn’t get any flow to it… I guess my “sense of urgency” was not there…..

I’ll go to the next home game, so the execution will be there, but I’m not really excited about it….. gotta admit… my sense of urgency is waning…..
Enjoyed your post Dusty! Imaginative and fun and made your points in an imaginative way. :towel:

In terms of your comments David, I agree that MW had his defense playing hard and coordinated. He finally took away the open flat area that we've given up in our four previous games with the Bombers and our defensive backs were playing more aggressively in this game.

But our defense was also aided by the facth that Adams, their best receiver and a guy who can beat a defender deep got injured early in the game, that Nichols was playing with a sore hand, and that the Bombers run a short passing offence and we knew that.

That takes nothing away from Washington's game plan or our defensive effort. But in terms of MW as a future Head Coach, Washington'd defense has come out in too many playoff games getting smoked to make me feel comfortable. His defense gave up 30 points to the Stamps in the first half of the West Final last year and almost as many to the Bombers n the first half of the Semi-Final last year. Washington's defense got dissected in the 2015 West Final and gave up 50 points to Montreal in an embarrassing loss in 2014.

One excellent defensive effort does not make me think that Washington is anything close to Head Coach material. This is a defensive coach whose defense has given up more big plays than any other defense in the league while also playing a conservative zone style of defense. But Washington, along with his defensive players deserve kudos for their game against the Bombers yesterday.

Like you Sir Percival, I don't have a lot of faith in Wally nor his hand picked assistants. Jeff Tedford made a huge mistake listening to Wally and keeping some of them.

We need fresh. Fresh thinking and fresh ideas. We need different. Same old has got us into this situation and same old will not get us out of it.

Wally is going to play some of the practice roster players over the next few games. Its a good idea to play some of them that have potential but Wally will also play them to vent his displeasure at our lack of 'execution and urgency'. Look for any outspoken players to be pined. Rainey will likely be the first.

I watched the video of Wally after the game yesterday and the smile on his face at times, after such a tough loss. Its almost as if he gets duping delight out of conning the media that it was a lack of 'urgency' that caused our defeat as well as he gets a delight out of blaming the players after a loss. He is like a fox with so many tricks up his sleeve. Dickenson said its hard to get a straight answer out of Wally. He likes to play games with words often or keep reporters in suspense.

Quite frankly I'm more than tired of his antics. As Dickenson once said “I'm starting to see why Wally is not universally loved,” Dickenson said. “When I came to Calgary, I heard certain guys struggling with the idea that Wally was their coach and GM".

Its a rare insight from a player into the Buono culture. Calgary was a very winning team, in terms of the time period that Dickenson was referring to in his comment.

I would love to see this team with a new HC/GM at the helm next season. I also see attendance dropping even more if Buono returns. Buono did a good job here at the start of his regime here in B.C. as he did in Calgary. But without the right pieces in place around Buono, success will be difficult to attain and Buono, left to his own devices, will not bring in the right pieces. Buono also needs the guidance of a Normie Kwong or a Bobby Ackles above him. That Is not in place or likely to arrive in place if Buono stays.

Right now Buono is the show and the show is not entertaining or bringing in the audience or delivering a good performance. Time to drop the curtain and put someone new in charge.
"When I went to Catholic high school in Philadelphia, we just had one coach for football and basketball. He took all of us who turned out and had us run through a forest. The ones who ran into the trees were on the football team". (George Raveling)

TheLionKing
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Sun Oct 15, 2017 4:38 pm

Don'the know about the rest of you but I have absolutely no urgency in renewing my tickets and I've been a 52 year season ticket holder

don corleone
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Sun Oct 15, 2017 5:06 pm

TheLionKing wrote:
Sun Oct 15, 2017 4:38 pm
I've been a 52 year season ticket holder
Kudos for being a fan.

Would love to see a Ring of Honor for fans who have given so much to the game.

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Rammer
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Sun Oct 15, 2017 6:01 pm

Bombers going into the game allowed ST returns like no other CFL team. Yet the Lions with Rainey were held in check.

Bombers are even worse than the Lions in giving up the big play were able to hold the Lions vaunted receiving corps in check.

O'Shea who is known for trick plays allowed Wally to use his practice week devoting his team to focus on preparation for the possibility. Then the Bombers didn't deploy or feel the need to use a 'trick play', like inferior teams are in the need to use. Wally was played out on the field and off if it.

Did Wally use a challenge flag? No probably due to his unsuccessful attempts burning him with legit challenges with more on the line late in games,.

In the end, another loss by a predictable team. Dorazio led OL just isn't up to pat with players that seem to have above average talent to me. DL pressure is lacking and to me the talent isn't average even. One could be corrected easily if a new GM was in place, the latter seems to have been recurring from season to season since the departure of Wake. DT is a position Wally chose to go lighter in weight, it hasn't worked. Yet it is an easy fix that a stubborn Wally hasn't moved from.

Execution is the problem, it is just the execution of the coaching that costs this team. The end of an era has passed through BC.
Entertainment value = an all time low

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Sir Purrcival
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Sun Oct 15, 2017 7:27 pm

DanoT wrote:
Sun Oct 15, 2017 12:52 pm
Sir Purrcival, I believe that you are overlooking the fact that Dickenson's wife and presumably her parents are from Calgary. She is also an executive for a Calgary oil company. So, he was never going to coach anywhere but Calgary. I believe that as a OC he turned down some HC opportunities elsewhere, deciding to stay in Calgary instead.

IIRC, at the end of Dave's playing career Wally did his usually release prior to expiry date and then when Dickenson played for the Stamps he was less than his normal very effective self.
I remember and there are no guarantees in this life but the fact remains that WB didn't even appear to try in this regard. DD was willing to stay here as a player but WB wouldn't have it and so he went back to Calgary where of course he preferred to be. Huff gave him a shot as player. Dave finally came to grips with the notion that he was done and then Calgary was there to roll out the welcome mat for his post playing career. Had Wally given him his chance here, he still might have gone to Calgary but who knows. We do know how Hufnagel handled it and now it is paying huge dividends.
Tell me how long must a fan be strong? Ans. Always.

B.C.FAN
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Mon Oct 16, 2017 12:00 pm

Matt Nichols credits B.C.'s defensive game plan for shutting down the Winnipeg offence.
“(The Lions defence) did some really good things,” said Nichols. “There were a few throws and reads I missed, we took some penalties… it was the culmination of a lot of things. There were a few things we did well. We moved the ball to flip field position when we started in our end a few times.

“There’s just some situations where, as an offence, we’ve got to find ways to get into the end zone. It was a tough one, a grinder, and they did some good things on defence.”

Nichols said the Lions did not play any man coverage and brought extra pressure off the edge to limit their ground game.

“We have ways to handle that and we didn’t do a good job of dealing with what we were supposed to do,” said Nichols. “They had a good gameplan. Their gameplan was to keep everything in front of them and they didn’t put their guys in man-to-man situations and that’s why you don’t see a lot of big plays when teams do that.

“We’ve got to find ways to move the football better to get them out of that and to get them to come down. It starts with our assignments in general, from all positions.”
UPON FURTHER REVIEW | BC 20, WPG 26
"I think [Fred Fateri] was like a lot of people who watch football, hockey or any professional sport on television. They sit there and think they could coach better than the professional. Some people really think that." - Bob Ackles, The Water Boy

Blitz
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Mon Oct 16, 2017 9:24 pm

:yahoo: Rick Dhaliwal @DhaliwalSports

Braley :"It's been a great disappointment this year but we will fix it, Wally over-all has done a good job." #BCLions
Anyone surprised? :yahoo:
"When I went to Catholic high school in Philadelphia, we just had one coach for football and basketball. He took all of us who turned out and had us run through a forest. The ones who ran into the trees were on the football team". (George Raveling)

TheLionKing
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Mon Oct 16, 2017 11:19 pm

Blitz wrote:
Mon Oct 16, 2017 9:24 pm
:yahoo: Rick Dhaliwal @DhaliwalSports

Braley :"It's been a great disappointment this year but we will fix it, Wally over-all has done a good job." #BCLions
Anyone surprised? :yahoo:
Braley is sicker than we thought. Wally doing a good job ?????? Guess Buono will be receiving a hefty Christmas bonus for the wonderful job he's doing.

leo4life
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Tue Oct 17, 2017 7:37 am

Expect the same ol same ol in 2018

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