Jovan leaves the Den. Confirmation on Page 8.

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Lionsfan65
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Toppy Vann wrote:Maybe it's both $$$/SMS and wanting someone more than JO. Who?
I don't know who Montreal has that we could possibly want, we're pretty set at reciever, and running back, Even if Jovan leaves we still have a pretty decent line. Really the question we have to ask is who/what does Montreal have that we would want. The only three possibilities that I could see would be more draft picks (although we already have their first for this year), Trading for one of their quarterbacks, (Although I like what we have with Lulay and Jennings, I wouldn't mind seeing Vernon Adams back.) Or the third possibility would be a pass rusher. John Bowman is getting pretty old though, and they just re signed Knapton. I really don't know.
Just another dimension to an already puzzling potential move. :dizzy: :shock:
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CardiacKid
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Lionsfan65 wrote:
Toppy Vann wrote:Maybe it's both $$$/SMS and wanting someone more than JO. Who?
I don't know who Montreal has that we could possibly want, we're pretty set at reciever, and running back, Even if Jovan leaves we still have a pretty decent line. Really the question we have to ask is who/what does Montreal have that we would want. The only three possibilities that I could see would be more draft picks (although we already have their first for this year), Trading for one of their quarterbacks, (Although I like what we have with Lulay and Jennings, I wouldn't mind seeing Vernon Adams back.) Or the third possibility would be a pass rusher. John Bowman is getting pretty old though, and they just re signed Knapton. I really don't know.
Just another dimension to an already puzzling potential move. :dizzy: :shock:
Don't trade for Adams...scuttlebutt has him being turfed in Montreal. The inability to read defences being the reason why....
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Gridiron Ernie
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I'm recalling there was that offhand comment without clarification in that mid-Feb Willes/Sun article about Wally and free-agency wherein Willes speculated "offensive tackle Jovan Olafioye may have priced himself off the team". I know folks here wondered about that at the time, what that actually meant. I certainly didn't/don't know, but it now comes back to me with some added intrigue.
I was just scanning the Montreal roster (LOL--likely a lot of us are) and wondered if perhaps someone like big young tackle Jacob Ruby (National) would be somehow involved in an exchange. Of course linebacker Bear Woods is fun to imagine in orange, but that position hardly strikes me as a serious point of need even with Biggie gone. Hey -- maybe Wally wants a 'return package' -- Phillips, Westerman & Adams back! (kidding).
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I'm a fan who would never try to tackle either the SMS or personnel decisions, but SG and Blitz have sure made compelling arguments. I know it's a harsh reality, but TL-14 is too expensive as a backup if it means losing an important player like JO. (Especially considering how much more competitive most of the league will be--excellent analysis Blitz). With a full season under his belt, JJ-10 really doesn't need the mentoring as much now.
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JohnHenry
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There's got to be more to this than just money. I won't speculate but it makes no sense to lose Olafoiye or Lulay because Wally overspent in free agency. Trading or releasing Lulay to save money is patently ridiculous, without a viable 3rd-stringer and our 24-yr-old starting QB phenom having a NFL tryout window after this season. It's not so easy to find starting import tackles either, you only have to look at the string of crummy import tackles the Lions have brought in over the past several seasons. Now they'll have to find two if Jovan goes? :ref:
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B.C.FAN
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In this league, teams will usually go as far as their backup quarterback will take them. With one or two exceptions (Henry Burris for four straight years from 2012 to 2015, Mike Reilly in 2013 and Jonathon Jennings in 2016), starting QBs don't play all 18 games.

Travis Lulay can't make the same throws as Jennings but he has the experience to take over the offence if Jennings gets hurt. And don't discount his value to the team from a marketing and PR perspective. I've mentioned before that Lulay was by far the most popular Lion at FanFest last year, drawing long lineups for autographs well after most players had signed a few autographs and left.
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AFAIK for 2017 Lulay makes $225k and Jennings $235. For 2018 Lulay is a free agent and Jennings makes $360. So Lulay doesn't seem likely to go anywhere.

Also Jennings may have a contract clause that allows him to test NFL interest prior to the start of 2018. His having played in a small school and only 6' tall means the NFL teams may view him as a career backup much like they did with Dickenson and Ray (both smallish but accurate passers) when they had their NFL looks.
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DanoT wrote:AFAIK for 2017 Lulay makes $225k and Jennings $235. For 2018 Lulay is a free agent and Jennings makes $360. So Lulay doesn't seem likely to go anywhere.

Also Jennings may have a contract clause that allows him to test NFL interest prior to the start of 2018. His having played in a small school and only 6' tall means the NFL teams may view him as a career backup much like they did with Dickenson and Ray (both smallish but accurate passers) when they had their NFL looks.
Backup QB salaries are a strange creature. Whatever Lulay is making could easily be deemed as too much money if he doesn't get called on and a bargain if something happened that sidelined Jennings for a significant portion of the season. Jennings is somewhat the proverbial elephant in the room. He's under contract at what amounts to a bargain this year and excellent value in 2018. Typically Wally would want to extend him prior to 2018 starting. I don't think he wants to be too hasty on pushing Lulay aside until he has a sense about securing Jennings beyond 2018. I believe to do that he needs to strike now and not wait until next offseason. I wonder if he mighthitting a home run now by tearing up the old deal and trying to bait Jennings with something like a 4 year deal that gets him up around $400K for 2017 and scales up from there? Could moving Olafioye be part of a move to clear up some cap to allow Buono to make a big pitch at extending Jennings?
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Regarding the topic of trading Olofiye, based on Farhan's report that Wally was wanting to shed salary, I believed it was wiser to look at other ways rather than trading Jovan, one of the best offensive linemen in the CFL and still a young 29. Olofioye is also a lineman who can play both tackle positions and has been relatively healthy during his years as a Leo.

In looking at ways to find savings elsewhere, one of the areas I looked at was Travis Lulay's salary and the notion of restructuring it, not getting rid of Lulay. Lulay is being highly paid as a backup quarterback. No question that every CFL team should have a quality backup who can come in and play well when a starter goes down. No question that Lualy is a popular Leo. But his pay scale is very high.

A second thought, long term, should Jennings try the NFL, is who would we want as our starting quarterback in that situation. I don't believe Jennings will do that and especially if we offered him a starting quarterback salary that reflects his value but part of that equation is the amount of salary we are paying Lulay. Right now we are paying $460,000 for two quarterbacks, essesntially dividing the salary between two players of which only one is playing a lot (and well). Travis Lulay was our starting quarterback from 2013 to most of 2016 and he was either injured or ineffective. I believe we need to be developing a young quarterback who would be able to step in, should Jennings ever leave or be hurt for a long time, who could give us the potential to win it all.

Travis is experienced but he is not our quarterback of the future, long term, should Jennings not be our starting quarterback for a long length of time, due to injury, or should he try the NFL.

We would be much better, for the longer term, to bring in a third string quarterback who we can develop and who could take over the backup role in 2018 from Lulay. At that time we could make Lulay our quarterback coach or even our third string quarterback/quarterback coach but Lulay's high salary right now hurts us in terms of potentially signing Jennings long term as well as it has an impact on us signing or keeping other players. I would much rather be paying for a starting offensive lineman like Olifoye than losing him due to too high a salary for a backup quarterback that no other team wants and who is not the long term answer should Jennings not be here. That is not a knock on Lulay as a person....just a view, right or wrong, in the best interest of the overall team.

Other options to reduce the SMS, without trading Olifioye including releasing Iannuzzi and going with Adekolu as our starter, with ether Blazsco or or using a cheaper import at the fourth International receiver postion, other than Nick Moore, should we go that way. With Manny, Burnham, Chris Williams, and Gore, our fifth receiver will need to play outside slotback. There are quality Internationals who can play that role or Adekolu could step into that spot (he is '6'4, 220, with excellent hands). Adekolu started the final regular season contest and recorded his first two pro receptions in the rout over Saskatchewan that locked up second place in the West Division. Adekolu then hauled in five receptions as our leader in passes caught in the Western Semi-Final victory over Winnipeg. Jennings obviously showed confidence in him. I don't think Iannuzzi has ever caught the most receptions in a game for us ever.

Iannuzzi is going into his 7th year as a starter. He had his best season last year with 360 yds or receptions but he has also had seasons of 65, 124 and 91 yds and he is never going to be a top echelon National receiver. We would be wiser to go with big targets as Adekolu or Blazsco or a speedster in Shaq Johnson, who broke the rookie CIS record and can make people miss. Ianazzui is a tweener who is neither big target nor a deep threat or an impressive YAC type.

I can understand Montreal wanting Olifoye and he is not expensive salary wise, compared to other CFL lineman of his stature. We need at least one International on our offensive line and who better than him. There have to be better ways to deal with the SMS than this.
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I would not want Lulay starting more than a game or two as I think he is done as a starting QB. That said, I have no problem with his salary and role. As i see it it, he has several roles on the team:

1. Back up QB. Can fill in for a game or two here and there.
2. Support for Jennings. Maybe Jennings doesn't need it, but he is very inexperienced and his game has gone off the rails at times, so I think it is helpful having Lulay there to step in for a few series or just to talk with Jennings.
3. Coach in training. If he is the next Dickenson, paying him now is an investment for later.
4. Face of the franchise. Great for marketing.

Overpaid as a player, yes, but all things considered, not a bad deal, especially given our overall QB costs.

I don't know what to think about Olafioye potentially getting moved. By all accounts, he is a terrific teammate, and still very able to compete. Hard to second-guess the reasons for exploring a trade without knowing what the reasons are. Cap trouble? Younger replacement available? 4 national o-linemen? Or just taking advantage of a good trade market?

If Vernon Adams was available in trade, I think Wally would definitely have to consider that. Going into last season, Adams was very highly touted (and highly regarded by Wally), and he performed well under the circumstances in his first year. If he could take another step forward next year, we would be protected in case Jennings goes south, or have a valuable asset to trade. We have a great young QB, but nothing in the pipeline should anything happen.
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Instead of getting rid of Olafoyie or Lulay because the Lions are short of cash with Wally overspending like a drunken sailor on other team's free agents, perhaps Wally should give back some of his ample salary for his failings? Dual GM/HC in the CFL can earn over $500k per. Would a restructuring be in order?

Let's not forget the Lions treatment of Dave Dickenson, signing him to a long-term contract in June/07 then releasing him 5 months later to avoid paying a roster bonus. Dickenson was recovering from a concussion at the time. Then apparently the Lions tried to lure DD back as OC and HC a couple years later. Thanks but no thanks. While DD was injured for much of '07, in his previous four Lion seasons he threw for 87 Td's with 26 Int's (114 QBR), playing in two Grey Cups and winning the championship in '06, and was named the league's Most Outstanding Player and Grey Cup Most Valuable Player.

Should the Lions now go to Lulay and say, "well, you know that contract we signed which you've honoured admirably by the way, we've changed our minds and decided to tear it up and release you if you won't take a pay cut starting this season. But trust us, we've got tremendous plans for you in the future!" :2cents:
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CardiacKid
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Nothing new on Farhan's Twitter feed.......
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It could be Wally's estimation that Jovan is nearing his expiry date and at this point there are decades worth of evidence that he's right about this.

But if salary is the issue, whatever you're paying Nick Moore at this point is too much. I don't fully ascribe to the old days of signing receivers off the street but let's be honest here; if I had to choose between the two, the decision isn't a hard one.

I don't like this. I don't like it a bit. Teams are built from the lines out and you keep a guy like Jovan as long as you can. Unless he wants to be close to home which would be Hamilton, not Montreal.
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CardiacKid wrote:Nothing new on Farhan's Twitter feed.......
Just reading between the lines on Farhan tweet:

It may not be a current year salary cap issue, but wally wants to extend Jovan at a far lower $ figure and Jovan is not interested in that. We all know how Wally feels after players reject extension offers.

So to get something for the asset before he is free agent next february, Wally called around and the Als were interested. To get full value back in return, wally is allowing the Als to negociate an extension (we assume at a far higher number than Wally offered)
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B.C.FAN
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Farhan's latest tweets don't shed much light on why the Als and not the Lions are trying to negotiate an extension with Jovan at a lower salary.
Farhan LaljiVerified account @FarhanLaljiTSN
Further to my report re possible Olafioye trade, #BCLions in talks with #Als. Next step is if Mtl can negotiate extension w/ Jovan at less $
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Roar Report Retweeted Farhan Lalji
Is the issue JO won't extend or is it #bclions cap space?

Reed" "no MTL player other than QB will be 150k+"

... interesting
Farhan Lalji‏Verified account @FarhanLaljiTSN
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@RoarReport For Lions it's about cap space. For a player of his stature, no way he considers a pay cut without an extension of something on back end
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