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DanoT
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Sun Oct 15, 2017 9:33 pm

The_Pauser wrote:
Sun Oct 15, 2017 3:13 pm
I'm glad to see the news that the Aquilini's interest in the team is waning. I've maintained from day 1 that I don't want these guys anywhere near the BC Lions. I had wavered a bit, under the condition that they are nothing more than a bank account and marketing resource for the team, and they bring in someone like David Sadoo as a part owner/managing partner of the team. If you look at how the Canucks have been driven into the ground due to their meddling ownership I don't understand how anyone who actually cares about the Lions would wish that fate on this team.

An ownership group headed by the Waterboys should be fine. Again, they will need to invest heavily in marketing and promotions, but these guys were all close with Bob Ackles, and are all successful businessmen that I'm not too worried.
While cross marketing promotions are an attractive possibility with a single ownership of the Canucks and Lions (double headers, anyone?) I too don't like how the Aquilini's operate.

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Sun Oct 15, 2017 10:14 pm

JohnHenry wrote:
Sun Oct 15, 2017 9:51 am


Braley was also accused of "dithering" the Argos sale to supposedly extract the maximum sale price, but he said after the deal concluded that Rogers was very tough to deal with, which held up negotiations. Rogers evicted the Argos from Skydome on the premise they were planting grass (a ridiculous idea which hasn't been mentioned since)..

I believe the new Blue Jays regime- Mark Shapiro/Ross Atkins- turfed the plan to put grass in Rogers Skydump. Yes, pun intended/

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David
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Mon Oct 16, 2017 12:33 pm

Good grief, what a mess. If Braley truly cared for this team and its fan base, then he would find a way to get this franchise into local hands where new owners could fix all the things he is either oblivious to, in denial about, or blindly loyal to.

Now it's litigation and "clear assets" that's preventing this transaction from moving forward :roll:
Rick Dhaliwal‏ @DhaliwalSports

Just talked with David Braley and got an update on the sale of the team

Braley : "The sale can't occur when there is 2 concussion lawsuits against the CFL with the #BCLions mentioned with the rest of the teams."

Braley :"You have the Arland Bruce concussion lawsuit , that could take till Christmas to figure out." #BCLions

Braley :"Concussion lawsuits prevent the assets from being sold because you have liability attached to them." #BCLions

Braley says there is interest from groups to buy the team, "but the assets have to be clear before I sell." #BCLions

DH :cool:
Please sell the team, Mr. Braley.

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Mon Oct 16, 2017 1:14 pm

David wrote:
Mon Oct 16, 2017 12:33 pm
Good grief, what a mess. If Braley truly cared for this team and its fan base, then he would find a way to get this franchise into local hands where new owners could fix all the things he is either oblivious to, in denial about, or blindly loyal to.

Now it's litigation and "clear assets" that's preventing this transaction from moving forward :roll:
Rick Dhaliwal‏ @DhaliwalSports

Just talked with David Braley and got an update on the sale of the team

Braley : "The sale can't occur when there is 2 concussion lawsuits against the CFL with the #BCLions mentioned with the rest of the teams."

Braley :"You have the Arland Bruce concussion lawsuit , that could take till Christmas to figure out." #BCLions

Braley :"Concussion lawsuits prevent the assets from being sold because you have liability attached to them." #BCLions

Braley says there is interest from groups to buy the team, "but the assets have to be clear before I sell." #BCLions

DH :cool:
I dunno. I can see folks interested in purchasing the club opting to defer until things are settled. I believe the two actions are Bruce's suit and a $200 million class action suit filed by Korey Banks and Eric "The Flea" Allen on behalf of all retired CFL players since 1952. According to a TSN article in 2015 the latter suit hinged on Bruce's suit going forward. Bruce's was dismissed by two BC courts who ruled that it should be settled through labour arbitration instead of the courts. In mid-August Bruce filed leave to appeal his case to the Supreme Court of Canada which is where it sits now. If I was a prospective buyer I don't think I'd be wanting to purchase something where I could be left holding the bag on the liability these cases potentially carry . I'm not a lawyer but I would assume should those two cases ultimately proceed and result in a significant settlement whomever owns the Lions at the time of settlement would be the ones liable for the Lions' portion.

One thing to keep in mind is that in a similar class-action concussion lawsuit the NFL settled to the tune of $1 billion with the first two claims settled under it resulting in $9 million in benefits.
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WestCoastJoe
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Mon Oct 16, 2017 2:12 pm

It looks like we are stuck.

Kind of glad to hear that it is not necessarily Braley dithering in selling a franchise he loves, nor holding out for an unreasonable price.

But this legal mess appears to be a serious obstacle to a sale.

Status quo. If Braley can't or won't sell, Wally will continue with the owner for at least one more year. Not for sure, of course. My guess ... 60-40 that Wally stays next year.

The issues that Arland Bruce and Korey Banks bring forth, IMO, threaten the existence of the league. The injuries the players receive are equal to those of the NFL, but the financial pictures of the two leagues are vastly different.

Ouch ...
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Mon Oct 16, 2017 6:58 pm

WestCoastJoe wrote:
Mon Oct 16, 2017 2:12 pm
It looks like we are stuck.

Kind of glad to hear that it is not necessarily Braley dithering in selling a franchise he loves, nor holding out for an unreasonable price.

But this legal mess appears to be a serious obstacle to a sale.

Status quo. If Braley can't or won't sell, Wally will continue with the owner for at least one more year. Not for sure, of course. My guess ... 60-40 that Wally stays next year.

The issues that Arland Bruce and Korey Banks bring forth, IMO, threaten the existence of the league. The injuries the players receive are equal to those of the NFL, but the financial pictures of the two leagues are vastly different.

Ouch ...
honestly, bruce has lost at every level ... i have no idea who is still paying his legal bills.
The $200m case doesn't have much merit as well. You have past american players suing the CFL because they don't have public health care in the US. How is the league responsible for that. Both probably will die after bruce lawsuit finally dies.
You have to deal with these issues in the CBA, and thats what the courts have said again and again in canada.

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Mon Oct 16, 2017 9:29 pm

David wrote:
Mon Oct 16, 2017 12:33 pm
Good grief, what a mess. If Braley truly cared for this team and its fan base, then he would find a way to get this franchise into local hands where new owners could fix all the things he is either oblivious to, in denial about, or blindly loyal to.

Now it's litigation and "clear assets" that's preventing this transaction from moving forward :roll:
Rick Dhaliwal‏ @DhaliwalSports

Just talked with David Braley and got an update on the sale of the team

Braley : "The sale can't occur when there is 2 concussion lawsuits against the CFL with the #BCLions mentioned with the rest of the teams."

Braley :"You have the Arland Bruce concussion lawsuit , that could take till Christmas to figure out." #BCLions

Braley :"Concussion lawsuits prevent the assets from being sold because you have liability attached to them." #BCLions

Braley says there is interest from groups to buy the team, "but the assets have to be clear before I sell." #BCLions

DH :cool:
The cynic in me says Braley is still holding out for top dollar which he
can't get as long as there is the prospect of a pending lawsuit. He is not in a rush to sell the Lions because he doesn't need the money but he does need to win The Deal.

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Toppy Vann
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Mon Oct 16, 2017 10:17 pm

It's a factor that a seller in declaring outstanding litigation but if this is the hangup I can't see anyone buying a team as this issue will not go away with a couple of lawsuits.

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Mon Oct 16, 2017 10:37 pm

DanoT wrote:
Mon Oct 16, 2017 9:29 pm
David wrote:
Mon Oct 16, 2017 12:33 pm
Good grief, what a mess. If Braley truly cared for this team and its fan base, then he would find a way to get this franchise into local hands where new owners could fix all the things he is either oblivious to, in denial about, or blindly loyal to.

Now it's litigation and "clear assets" that's preventing this transaction from moving forward :roll:
Rick Dhaliwal‏ @DhaliwalSports

Just talked with David Braley and got an update on the sale of the team

Braley : "The sale can't occur when there is 2 concussion lawsuits against the CFL with the #BCLions mentioned with the rest of the teams."

Braley :"You have the Arland Bruce concussion lawsuit , that could take till Christmas to figure out." #BCLions

Braley :"Concussion lawsuits prevent the assets from being sold because you have liability attached to them." #BCLions

Braley says there is interest from groups to buy the team, "but the assets have to be clear before I sell." #BCLions

DH :cool:
The cynic in me says Braley is still holding out for top dollar which he
can't get as long as there is the prospect of a pending lawsuit. He is not in a rush to sell the Lions because he doesn't need the money but he does need to win The Deal.
I can appreciate Braley’s reasoning in regards to liability but a couple of things stick in my mind...

I don’t think the issue of player concussions and their legal ramifications will ever have a due date in the foreseeable future. The 2 lawsuits currently under consideration MAY come to an end by the start of 2018. I seriously doubt these 2 will be the only attempts by former CFL players to get compensation.

So, while I am definitely not a lawyer, the Sword of Damocles and associated liability could be poised above any sale for some time, waiting to cleave the head from any group wishing to buy the team.

Also, why has this hurdle not been part of the previous public discussion? Bruce’s legal efforts have hardly been hush-hush. Yes the Leo’s are a private business and Braley has every right to be as circumspect or forthcoming as he wishes. But I find the communication on the part of Braley to be obtuse and for myself, very frustrating.

DanoT
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Tue Oct 17, 2017 3:41 am

Toppy Vann wrote:
Mon Oct 16, 2017 10:17 pm
It's a factor that a seller in declaring outstanding litigation but if this is the hangup I can't see anyone buying a team as this issue will not go away with a couple of lawsuits.
^^^Agreed. This issue might be lowering the value of a CFL team but if it is enough of an issue to prevent an immediate sale, then whatever happens with the current lawsuits doesn't really prevent future lawsuits against the CFL and so the issue still remains.

The bigger long term issue might be that current and future knowledge about sports related concussions might lead to "Mothers don't let your boys grow up to be football players".

DanoT
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Tue Oct 17, 2017 3:41 am

Toppy Vann wrote:
Mon Oct 16, 2017 10:17 pm
It's a factor that a seller in declaring outstanding litigation but if this is the hangup I can't see anyone buying a team as this issue will not go away with a couple of lawsuits.
^^^Agreed. This issue might be lowering the value of a CFL team but if it is enough of an issue to prevent an immediate sale, then whatever happens with the current lawsuits doesn't really prevent future lawsuits against the CFL and so the issue still remains.

The bigger long term issue might be that current and future knowledge about sports related concussions might lead to "Mothers don't let your boys grow up to be football players".

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SammyGreene
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Tue Oct 17, 2017 4:43 pm

More from TSN's David Naylor on how the team won't be sold anytime soon. I find the current "search" for a new club president comical. Dennis Skulsky originally announced in February 2016 he was resigning but stayed on when Braley fell ill.
“I’ll move on when the time is right,” Skulsky said. “It could be a month, it could be two months. It could be the end of the season. We’ll see. We need to have someone leading the club.”
So here we are at the end of the 2017 season and Skulsky is still around and the marketing plan is failing miserably.The fact they have lost at least 15,000 season ticket holders in the last decade is enough to be fired at some point.
Just how low the season ticket base can go will sadly be the theme in 2018.
Braley doesn’t expect to sell Lions this year

B.C. Lions owner David Braley maintains he still intends to sell his Canadian Football League team, but he doesn’t expect to complete a transaction before the end of the calendar year.
“The reason for that is the [concussion] lawsuits,” said Braley. “[Former player] Arland Bruce sued us for concussions and there’s a class-action suit as well. Until those things are cleaned up, the asset can’t be free.”

Braley, 76, a resident of Burlington, Ont., has said he would like to divest himself of his team by the end of this season.
Reports out of Vancouver say Braley is believed to be dealing with three interested parties, one of which is The Waterboys, the support network of local business leaders put together by the late Bob Ackles, a former Lions president.
It is believed the Waterboys group is willing to pay in the $14 million to $15 million range, while Braley is believed be seeking about $20 million, according to sources.
The Lions are 6-9, have lost seven of their past eight games, and are in danger of missing the playoffs for the first time since 1996, the season before Braley became owner.
In the meantime, amid falling attendance and a reduced presence in the market, the Lions have been without a team president since January, with Braley overseeing operations from his home in Ontario.
“We’ve interviewed a number of people [for the president’s position],” Braley said. ““It takes time to find the right person.”
Hiring a president at the same time as negotiating a sale may be part of what has fuelled some doubt around the CFL that Braley truly intends to part with his team.

Two lower courts in B.C. have dismissed Bruce’s suit but t he has asked the Supreme Court of Canada to hear his case.
TSN legal analyst Eric Macramalla said that while the lawsuits against the CFL are worthy of consideration by any prospective owner, both suits face long odds and appear to pose a manageable risk.
“There is no doubt that pending litigation can influence whether a sale is finalized,” Macramalla said. “The last thing a new owner wants is to be saddled with paying a significant monetary award. In the case of pending concussion litigation against the CFL, I would expect that it would be a relevant consideration which warrants examination. However, an owner may not be dissuaded from buying a CFL team as the risk of liability, while possible, is not sufficiently likely or significant.”

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David
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Tue Oct 17, 2017 6:46 pm

SammyGreene wrote:
Tue Oct 17, 2017 4:43 pm
More from TSN's David Naylor on how the team won't be sold anytime soon. I find the current "search" for a new club president comical. Dennis Skulsky originally announced in February 2016 he was resigning but stayed on when Braley fell ill.
I feel your pain, Sammy. Braley was on CKWX radio this morning, saying how disappointed he is in the season, but that "Wally has done a good job." This has all the earmarks of a "same-old, same-old" off-season.

Same staff!

Same pricing structure!

Same seating configuration!

Same minuscule presence in the market!


DH :cool:
Please sell the team, Mr. Braley.

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WestCoastJoe
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Tue Oct 17, 2017 7:52 pm

Some speculation here ...

If Braley, for any reason, does not sell prior to next season, one might think Wally could delegate the HC role to Mark Washington.

Aiiee yiee yieee

And yet it might be an improvement on the present situation. Do we really know what kind of philosophy Mark W would have as HC? He is younger, no doubt more energetic, with his own ideas. Might Wally be ready to let go, something he has said is difficult for him to do? Might Wally, in view of all that has been happening, be willing to let a new HC truly take charge?

Do you want the blue pill or the red pill? My gawd ... Too difficult a concept to ponder at this time?

It is such a schmozzle now. Braley evidently senses the angst of the fans, thus the interviews. Are his comments helpful, or do they just reveal the extent of the impasse, and the likelihood of status quo next year?

It is obvious fans are extremely restless. And there is no seeming relief out there.

So here are two elderly men, hugely successful in life, and in football, facing transition, and it is not going well, or easily. Both men have had health issues. They have my sympathy. But this is pro sports. As Wally says, there is no pity in football, neither on the field, nor at the turnstiles.

Just some speculation, as I cannot help but feel the odds favour a continuation of the status quo next year. Just some speculation, mulling a nagging situation, an ache.

We are in hard times here.
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Jimmy Johnson's Game Keys: Protect the ball. Make plays.

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TheLionKing
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Tue Oct 17, 2017 8:16 pm

WestCoastJoe wrote:
Tue Oct 17, 2017 7:52 pm

And yet it might be an improvement on the present situation. Do we really know what kind of philosophy Mark W would have as HC? He is younger, no doubt more energetic, with his own ideas. Might Wally be ready to let go, something he has said is difficult for him to do? Might Wally, in view of all that has been happening, be willing to let a new HC truly take charge?

Wouldn't make one iota of difference. Buono will "mentor" Washington from the cherry picker. More of the same with the same skipper at the helm of the Titanic.

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