At what point do we look to next year?

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LFITQ
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Mon Sep 29, 2014 1:25 pm

Travis Lulay out.
Andrew Harris out.
Courtenay Taylor out.
Brian Burnham out with a lacerated spleen.

An anemic offense. A Defense that is top notch. A QB who seems to rather throw to the opposition than to his own players. No deep ball. No protection for the QB to deliver the deep threat.

I don't know about you guys, but I'm ready to pass the torch to Partridge and let him get some "bullets flying" experience to help develop him for next season. Beck has been 3rd stringer all his playing days and is not the future of this franchise. This appears to be Glenn's swan song. I'm not sure if Lulay will be back (I'm hoping he will be better than ever). That leaves us with Partridge and a dilapidated and disheartened receiver corps, along with a offensive line that seems to be having problems blocking (drive or pass protecting) in a high school game (that left side is atrocious).

Is it the coaching staff? Even if it is, there's not much that can be done at this time about it. You can't just fire coaches midstream in football and expect anything to come of it for this season. That will have to come once the regular season is over.

But what you can do is give some of the backups the starting roles and just get back to some basic football. Forget about schemes and movements and just get back to really simple football. Keep it simple for the linemen, keep it simple for the QB, keep it simple for the receivers. That way if you have the talent that can execute, then let them do what their god-given talent has let them do to this point - just play it simply and let their bodies and muscle memory take over. Get their heads out of the game and let it go back to natural talent and instincts.

Perhaps then their heads will get into a good spot where you can change things up again. But right now the fundamentals aren't there, and it is showing. Too much thinking is taking place and it is interfering with the talent we have.
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cromartie
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Mon Sep 29, 2014 2:06 pm

I thought you ended up in witness protection. Nice to read your stuff again.

This does not strike me as a coaching staff inclined to give up on the year. Really, even if they can make the eastern crossover, and there's no reason to think that isn't at least a possibility with Glenn and this defense, they'll continue to go all out, bringing in more imports to stem the tide of injuries on offense as best they can.

In fact, I seldom see a coaching staff, even one that knows the Sword of Damocles is about to fall on their necks, play for next year for the sake of the franchise. The last, and really only one, I can remember doing that was Andy Reid in his last year in Philadelphia.

So expect this team to keep kicking at the can and continuing to insist the players, and not the scheme, are the problem. All the way to that first round loss somewhere in the GTA.

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KnowItAll
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Mon Sep 29, 2014 2:09 pm

never look to next year until you are mathematically eliminated this year.
Every day that passes is one you can't get back

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Sir Purrcival
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Mon Sep 29, 2014 2:31 pm

My tongue in cheek response would be "3 weeks ago".

I stated in another thread not long ago that in fact this team really has no business looking for a playoff spot. They may have been somewhat intemperate words after another game disappointment but deep down there where some grains of sincerity. The part of me that would like to see the season over so we can hopefully begin to put right what is wrong says, play all the backups, give them some playing time. However the part of me that says never give up, never surrender says that it isn't only about about my feelings. First of all, there are the fans who feel differently. They have paid money in many cases to see the Lions put forth their best efforts whatever those efforts should be. Since the Lions are still in playoff contention the fans are entitled to those efforts. Secondly, there are the players themselves. Whatever we may think of their collective efforts, they also want to do their best and I'm sure that they wouldn't appreciate seeing an apparent throwing of the towel when there is still a chance to succeed. Among other things, the bad feelings that might engender would be a terrible foundation for a new season with hopefully a new structure. No, I think until the fates of the team this season are determined, they have to put forth their best personnel regardless of who comprises that group. With all the injuries, lots of the backups are going to get play time as the coaches struggle to keep a team on the field.
Last edited by Sir Purrcival on Mon Sep 29, 2014 2:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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leo4life
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Mon Sep 29, 2014 2:32 pm

Glen Suitor was on 1040 earlier and said the Lions have a decent shot at playoffs if they can get some receiver help and shore up the OL protection....nothing we dont know already but this team is week to week these days

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LFITQ
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Mon Sep 29, 2014 2:32 pm

But at this point we know the frustration that is the current offense. Wouldn't it at least be time to look at alternatives? If you keep doing what you've always done, you'll keep getting what you've always gotten. And in this case it means an offense that cannot put points on the board.

Even if we are still looking at this season and playing in our own park, doesn't it at least merit some type of significant change to see if perhaps we already have the "next one" waiting in the wings? Shouldn't we be looking to shake things up and see what sticks to the branches and what falls off as dead weight?

If the change doesn't get us what we want for this year, it can at least provide us a glimpse into what might be there next season. If it does get the change required, then where's the problem? Either way, I only see it as a win win.

So let me summarize:

Keep the same people in, keep doing what we've been doing - keep losing games and fans, no development for next season no success this year. Lose - Lose.
Keep the same people in, change up the plan. That is saying the plan is wrong all along. I can't see the coaches on this staff admitting to that.
Put different people in, keep the same game plan. If we win, then the plan is sound it was the people. If we lose, then the plan or the people are wrong and we gone no further.
Put different people in, simplify it to their strengths. If we win, then we are where we want to be. If we lose, then perhaps the people are wrong for the job and we are back to square one but we know where we need to be next season.

As for witness protection. I could tell ya but....
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LFITQ
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Mon Sep 29, 2014 2:33 pm

leo4life wrote:Glen Suitor was on 1040 earlier and said the Lions have a decent shot at playoffs if they can get some receiver help and shore up the OL protection....nothing we dont know already but this team is week to week these days
I'd almost say they are "weak" to "weak". :tease:
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sj-roc
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Mon Sep 29, 2014 3:25 pm

LFITQ wrote:
leo4life wrote:Glen Suitor was on 1040 earlier and said the Lions have a decent shot at playoffs if they can get some receiver help and shore up the OL protection....nothing we dont know already but this team is weak, too weak these days
I'd almost say they are "weak" to "weak". :tease:
There, I fixed it.
Sports can be a peculiar thing. When partaking in fiction, like a book or movie, we adopt a "Willing Suspension of Disbelief" for enjoyment's sake. There's a similar force at work in sports: "Willing Suspension of Rationality". If you doubt this, listen to any conversation between rival team fans. You even see it among fans of the same team. Fans argue over who's the better QB or goalie, and selectively cite stats that support their views while ignoring those that don't.

TheLionKing
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Mon Sep 29, 2014 3:27 pm

The record says you are what you are. With the exception of the defence, the Lions are an average team. When the Lions fired Chapdelaine I was delighted. Khari Jones has been a major disappointment. He is way over his head. Slow to make adjustments and what adjustments he makes are often too late and ineffective. Frankly tired of Buono's cronies running this team year after year. The team has regress year after year under Benevides. Time for a change.

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Rammer
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Mon Sep 29, 2014 3:55 pm

Well that the East started out even more pathetic than the Lions, means that mathematically we can't, but the heart is telling my head that it is all over but the crying.
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KnowItAll
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Mon Sep 29, 2014 5:44 pm

Rammer wrote:Well that the East started out even more pathetic than the Lions, means that mathematically we can't, but the heart is telling my head that it is all over but the crying.
There will always be something to cry about.
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notahomer
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Mon Sep 29, 2014 9:29 pm

In some ways next year concerns me. I long for the days where we'd bicker which of the backups should be starting. Hard to believe that we used to have a stable of QB's and it leaves one wondering about next year.

I watched the Cowboys game last night (I know-CFL forum). They admit they bit the bullet and focussed on fixing their O-line realizing having a great QB (depending on your perspective of ROMO) is pointless without a solid O-line. Apparently theirs had gotten too old, too fast.... Looked good last night....

Now, it sounds like the Lions are trying the same thing. Upgrades at O-line every year but it still seems to be the weak spot.

I'm not done cheering on the Lions for this year but I've been wondering about next year for a while now......

B.C.FAN
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Mon Sep 29, 2014 10:01 pm

Things look bleak without Harris and Taylor/Burnham but the Lions aren't the only team struggling on offence. In fact, they held Calgary's offence without a TD on Saturday, the third time in four games they've held an opponent out of the end zone. Saskatchean and Winnipeg are also struggling to score lately. The Lions' offensive average of 19.6 points a game is better than that of four other teams and less than a TD behind Calgary's league-leading average of 26.2 points. And the Lions rank fourth in net offence and in TD pases, first in average gain per pass and have the second most first downs passing.

Whether the Lions can move the ball without Harris and Taylor/Burnham is a big question, but their offensive production to date is at least playoff-worthy. I hope that Travis Lulay plays the final two games of the regular season when he is eligible to come of the 6-game IL on Nov. 1. If his shoulder holds up, he could be the spark lift the offence to new heights as he was last year.

Defensively, the Lions rank No. 1 or No. 2 in most key categories. Defence wins championships. The Lions have a lot on the line this year with a home Grey Cup that has yet to sell out. They still have to scrap and fight for every victory they can get. They are capable of beating anyone in the regular season or playoffs. Next year starts after Nov. 30.
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David
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Mon Sep 29, 2014 10:29 pm

notahomer wrote:Upgrades at O-line every year but it still seems to be the weak spot.

I'm not done cheering on the Lions for this year but I've been wondering about next year for a while now......
When healthy, I believe our O-linemen (Steward, Hardrick, Norman, Valli, and Olafioye) can be in the top 3rd in the league. Calgary and Saskatchewan's are probably better, but I still maintain our guys are not well coached. Too much technique in their heads - thinking instead of reacting in order to please their position coach. Questionable schemes. Norman and Fabien starting out with so much promise but sliding backward. You can have a highly regarded, tenured, published university professor walk into a high school to teach a group of 16 year-olds physics. It doesn't mean that they're going to excel with this instruction, and I think that is what's at play here.

Take Edmonton. You can't tell me that rag-tag group that includes the likes of Justin Sorensen, Simeon Rottier, and Matt O'Donnell has more talent than ours. Yet they mostly manhandled Saskatchwan's defensive line last week. Meanwhile, we start 3 internationals and still struggled at times. Pass protection was marginally better but we couldn't open holes for our running backs any better than we did in say, Week 3. In fact, I'm not sure we would have done any better with 5 imports. Having Kelly Bates or Bryan Chiu (if we can lure him from the Argos) take over this group next year would be a breath of fresh air!


DH :cool:
Please sell the team, Mr. Braley.

DanoT
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Mon Sep 29, 2014 10:40 pm

David wrote:
notahomer wrote:Upgrades at O-line every year but it still seems to be the weak spot.

I'm not done cheering on the Lions for this year but I've been wondering about next year for a while now......
When healthy, I believe our O-linemen (Steward, Hardrick, Norman, Valli, and Olafioye) can be in the top 3rd in the league. Calgary and Saskatchewan's are probably better, but I still maintain our guys are not well coached. Too much technique in their heads - thinking instead of reacting in order to please their position coach. Questionable schemes. Norman and Fabien starting out with so much promise but sliding backward. You can have a highly regarded, tenured, published university professor walk into a high school to teach a group of 16 year-olds physics. It doesn't mean that they're going to excel with this instruction, and I think that is what's at play here.

Take Edmonton. You can't tell me that rag-tag group that includes the likes of Justin Sorensen, Simeon Rottier, and Matt O'Donnell has more talent than ours. Yet they mostly manhandled Saskatchwan's defensive line last week. Meanwhile, we start 3 internationals and still struggled at times. Pass protection was marginally better but we couldn't open holes for our running backs any better than we did in say, Week 3. In fact, I'm not sure we would have done any better with 5 imports. Having Kelly Bates or Bryan Chiu (if we can lure him from the Argos) take over this group next year would be a breath of fresh air!


DH :cool:
Kelly Bates as O line coach would be a breath of fresh air indeed. The university professor was a great analogy because Teflon Dan Dorazio pretty much has tenure as a Lions coach. :bang:

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